Josie and the Pussycats (2001)

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Track 1: Hello, and welcome to Left of the Projector. I'm your host, Evan,

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Track 1: back again with another film discussion from the left.

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Track 1: Wherever you're listening, give us a rating and subscribe so you'll be notified

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Track 1: of our weekly episodes that drop every Tuesday. And now on to the show.

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Track 1: This week on the show, we'll be discussing the 2001 film Josie and the Pussycats,

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Track 1: which did not get too much press or, you know, good reviews upon its initial release.

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Track 1: But in retrospect, I think we have a great film to discuss today.

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Track 1: It stars a whole host of people, Tara Reid, Rosario Dawson, Rachel Lee Cook,

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Track 1: Alan Cumming, Gabriel Mann, Missy Pyle, Parker Posey, and some others that appear

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Track 1: early on in the film, which we will get to shortly.

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Track 1: The film was not a commercial success, making just $15 million on a $22 to $39

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Track 1: million budget. I don't know why there's such a wide range, perhaps marketing and all those things.

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Track 1: But with us to discuss, we have a friend of the show, Smirk Gently.

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Track 1: Thank you for being here, as always.

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Track 3: Thank you so much. And thanks for doing this, because I feel like I pestered

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Track 3: you about it for a little while.

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Track 1: I know and in full disclosure bill and i have never seen this movie until not

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Track 1: today i've watched it for the first time two days for.

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Track 2: Me it was last night so.

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Track 3: I'm i'm so glad to be that person for both of you and i'm so happy to make this happen.

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Track 1: And it wasn't like i feel like everybody needs to see this intentionally like

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Track 1: not watching this and i think unfortunately i think it has to do with just the sort of uh,

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Track 1: the way that it's the film is sort of viewed i think.

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Track 3: Again even.

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Track 1: Though i think there's like this reappraisal of it i think it

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Track 1: still suffers from that early 2000s sort

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Track 1: of uh i don't know what to call it uh era where there was a lot of crappy dude

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Track 1: bro comedy films that clogged the arteries of the film industry and this one

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Track 1: kind of floated under the radar and so i have to ask you how did you or why

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Track 1: did you want to discuss this film like what was it uh about it i mean.

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Track 3: I think it's partly because of that i think the movie is so much fun i've seen it so many times,

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Track 3: purely because it was just on always like it

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Track 3: was one of those that didn't do really well in theater so it was on like a lot

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Track 3: i don't know maybe it was like comedy central or like one of the movie channels

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Track 3: that we had when like my dad had direct tv for some reason but it was on all

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Track 3: the time so it was just i feel like it was always on in the background and i

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Track 3: think it's so clever and cute but it's also really cheesy in a way that I enjoy.

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Track 3: And for me, it occupies the same space in my mind as like Mystery Men and Zoolander

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Track 3: as far as these like satirical, like industry sort of films.

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Track 3: And I think you had mentioned to me that you hadn't seen it. I'm like, you have to-

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Track 3: I feel like everybody has to see this movie.

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Track 1: My Letterboxd review is literally, it's funny you said Zoolander was,

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Track 1: that Zoolander and the movie They Live had a baby, and the baby is this film.

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Track 1: And it does have a similar humor aspect as Zoolander, and it has a subversive

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Track 1: sort of undertone that's beating you over the head with like a bat as to how kind of blatant it is.

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Track 2: Calling it an undertone is, that's a stretch of that.

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Track 1: It's an overtone.

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Track 2: The definition of undertone. It's funny you mention Mystery Men because this,

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Track 2: like Mystery Men, is based on a comic book.

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Track 2: And this really, you know, we all talk about Spider-Man, you know,

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Track 2: as like, you know, the film that started the Superman renaissance or superhero renaissance in film.

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Track 2: But really, it's Josie and the Pussycats.

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Track 2: A full year. You did that. A full year. A full year.

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Track 2: 2002, a full year before Spider-Man, the Sam Raimi Spider-Man movies,

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Track 2: Josie and the Pussycats.

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Track 2: This is the movie that brought comics to the film.

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Track 1: I mean, I won't argue you too much there. But yes, and for anyone who doesn't know.

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Track 2: You won't engage in my not serious, facetious argument?

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Track 1: No.

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Track 3: It's like I'm not going to dignify that. I'm just going to move right.

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Track 1: I'm not going to dignify that with the response.

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Track 3: I'm rolling right along.

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Track 1: But for anyone who doesn't know look isn't familiar

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Track 1: with jose and the pussycats it's based it was a band within the archie comic

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Track 1: universe and then it became its own spinoff comic book and i think there was

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Track 1: also a tv show and there's obviously this film and there has now been more recently

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Track 1: yeah cartoon and there's also the show riverdale which is sort of like a teen,

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Track 1: drama about archie's world and the jose and the pussycats is sort of within

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Track 1: that world as well and then like Sabrina is also kind of in the same world. So it's kind of this.

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Track 2: But kind of, she is. She's, that's the Riverdale. That's the Riverdale universe.

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Track 1: The Riverdale universe? What do they call it?

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Track 2: Yes, it is.

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Track 3: Yeah. But she lives in like the next town over or something.

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Track 3: She doesn't, yeah, she lives.

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Track 3: So they show up in the dark and gritty Sabrina, like Netflix show from a few years back.

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Track 3: I fucking love that show. It's ridiculous.

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Track 2: Have you also watched Riverdale?

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Track 3: So I watched, I think the first one or two seasons. It's all a blur.

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Track 2: I mean, it got pretty bad. It got pretty bad.

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Track 3: It was crazy right off the bat. There was like...

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Track 2: Yeah, but I mean, it got like bad, but like in a really bad way.

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Track 2: I mean, there is an entire... I mean, there's an entire story arc involving

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Track 2: the drug known as, I believe, Jingle Jangle, which is just Pixie Stix.

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Track 2: It's just Pixie Stix. This is Jingle Jangle. And they talk about it all series. It's like...

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Track 2: Are you distributing Jingle Jangle?

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Track 1: I also got through about two seasons of that show. And my problem with that

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Track 1: show, not just getting crazy, is just that those shows, network shows,

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Track 1: took 24 episodes per season.

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Track 1: That would have been so good if it had been like 10 episode seasons, like more.

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Track 1: I hate using the stupid term like prestige TV, but like maybe slightly more.

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Track 1: Anyway, we don't need to go into the full Riverdale.

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Track 2: We need to talk about Jingle Jangle.

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Track 1: Yeah, we don't have to talk about Jingle Jangle on this. show

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Track 1: but like so for anyone who hasn't seen the film like it

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Track 1: starts off with not the joes and

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Track 1: the pussycats sort of leading the film it's this band called du

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Track 1: jour which is a boy band with

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Track 1: you know a lot of people you've you've seen like donald

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Track 1: face and seth green um what is

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Track 1: that breckenmire who you know from like the american pie no is he in american

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Track 1: pie no uh no he's in like road trip and like the craft and a few other things

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Track 1: in that like clueless clueless of course yes come on the stoner and clueless uh and so like you my.

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Track 2: Favorite part about du jour is if you go on the

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Track 2: wikipedia page for josey and the pussycats the fourth

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Track 2: member doesn't have a page the guy with the monkey no no less he doesn't have

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Track 2: he has nothing he has nothing he is like his non-antigeness in the movie is

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Track 2: reflected in our reality.

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Track 1: That's funny i didn't i i just i was reading from it and i didn't notice that

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Track 1: he didn't have his own page that's that's a little bit sad but yeah it's.

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Track 2: Kind of sad.

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Track 1: So they have this they're this sort of uh

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Track 1: you know big pop sensation they have a huge crowd and they're

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Track 1: sort of it's very they're very like initially leading you

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Track 1: into this memory hole for some people of the early

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Track 1: 2000s of like boy bands and spice girls and backstreet boys and in sync and

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Track 1: this whole thing yeah it's really well done it's like this idea of like you

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Track 1: know you step off a plane and there's a crowd you know excited to see them and

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Track 1: then they also have the um the most amazing hit single oh.

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Track 3: My god the lyrics to the song oh my god.

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Track 1: Backdoor lover is the name of the song that's.

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Track 3: A crime it's so funny.

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Track 1: Their dance is incredible they're.

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Track 3: Wearing you have seth green and like a feather boa and like that very,

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Track 3: like, late 90s sort of top hat situation.

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Track 3: Kind of, oh, like, four non-blondes. Like, she used to wear the top hat and

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Track 3: everything, and then it became, like, yeah, it's just... It's wild to see.

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Track 3: Also, all these dudes, I know that they're not...

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Track 3: much older than like boy band members were

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Track 3: at the time but they they seem so much older because i think of seth green as

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Track 3: like he is now it's insane to see to see him in that they're also not like typically

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Track 3: like these are not like bad looking dudes but they don't look like boy band

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Track 3: members it's just no it's very funny i.

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Track 2: Could see as a i could see donald fason fason as a as a as a boy band so at that.

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Track 3: Age oh yeah yeah nowadays he's.

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Track 2: Like fucking 45 years old like he looks.

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Track 3: He's older though is he that is he.

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Track 1: I don't know exactly how.

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Track 2: Old he is.

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Track 1: Well he's he's about to be in the new uh the scrubs uh uh reboot yeah he's 51 i'm.

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Track 2: Sorry yeah he's he's got a full decade on me.

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Track 1: Well does anyone do we do we need to do i need to read the lyrics for the part of this Yes.

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Track 2: You do. Or I will, if you'd like.

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Track 1: Okay.

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Track 2: Because I just pulled them up.

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Track 1: This kind of love is wrong, but you know it feels so fine. What if my hands cross your cheek?

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Track 1: Oh, so smooth as wine. Be the light baby and unlock your back door.

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Track 1: I'll be coming through, then waiting up to love you for sure.

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Track 1: That's the chorus. And then they have, you know, I don't need to read this entire.

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Track 1: lying on your bed, staring up at the moon. You got me crazy, but I'll love you soon.

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Track 1: And then it says, I'm your backdoor lover coming from behind with the lights

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Track 1: still on, backdoor lover, and so on.

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Track 2: I really like running my hands across your cheeks. They're oh so smooth and white.

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Track 2: So leave the light on, baby, and unlock your backdoor.

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Track 2: Like, truly, this is, this movie opens with this. It opens with this.

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Track 3: It does. You just dive right in, right from there.

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Track 1: I assume what they're referring to is like, you leave your door open because

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Track 1: like you don't have to worry about crime. And so your door is just open. Is that what they're?

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Track 3: Yeah.

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Track 2: This is about safe neighborhoods.

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Track 3: Yeah.

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Track 3: That's exactly what it is. You nailed it.

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Track 1: I got it. I understand the film.

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Track 3: You did.

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Track 2: It really, like, this movie does not ease you in.

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Track 2: Unlike being a backdoor lover, this movie does not ease you in.

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Track 2: It just, right off the bat, I mean, you know, let's see, in the plane they have

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Track 2: boxes of bounce laundry sheets framed on the walls.

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Track 2: and then jugs of Dawn dish soap. I believe it's Dawn. I think it's Dawn dish soap.

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Track 1: Just like The plane is also sponsored by Target across.

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Track 3: Yes, by the entire thing.

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Track 2: Yes, it's the Target thing and then the Target is everywhere.

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Track 3: Everywhere. Motorola is the plane later on.

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Track 1: Right.

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Track 2: Yes.

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Track 3: Motorola crap everywhere.

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Track 2: Yeah.

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Track 3: Yeah. It just hits you in the face with the branding and it's funny because

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Track 3: this whole movie is about like advertising and the spoilers.

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Track 3: It's about subliminal advertising and consumerism and some of the complaints

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Track 3: from actual critics were that it was hypocritical to be doing this much product

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Track 3: placement in a movie with a message like this.

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Track 3: I feel like so many people missed the point.

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Track 3: Part of why it did so poorly is because they were saying when it came out,

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Track 3: they're like, okay, I think we really didn't think about the fact that 13-year-olds

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Track 3: were going to watch this.

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Track 3: And they were also the people that, like, weren't going to get it.

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Track 3: But then that happened with the critics, too.

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Track 3: And they just, they, yeah, they got totally screwed.

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Track 1: Guys, are these the same people who also didn't get Starship Troopers?

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Track 3: They're probably the same people. Or at least they talked to each other.

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Track 2: Did critics not get Starship Troopers? I thought critics at least got it.

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Track 1: No, they did not get it. They said, this is too overtly, like, fascist.

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Track 2: I forgot. Starship Troopers is Evans Roam. So, you know.

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Track 3: Yeah.

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Track 1: Yeah. Yeah, the reviews were very much exactly like you said.

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Track 1: Roger Ebert gave it one and a half stars, saying that Josie and the Pusscats

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Track 1: are not dumber than Spice Girls, but they're as dumb as the Spice Girls, which is dumb enough.

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Track 1: That's your review of this. Also, this would be a great double feature with Spice World.

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Track 3: By the way. You would.

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Track 2: I have to say, though, like there is I do think there is kind of merit to the idea.

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Track 2: It's like you're making a movie about the evils of product placement,

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Track 2: but you're still doing product placement.

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Track 2: Quite a lot of it, actually. Like it's everywhere.

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Track 2: There's still something to be said about that. Like you are doing what you're criticizing a lot.

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Track 3: Is i guess it's kind of you could you could be venturing into like a pose law sort of uh,

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Track 3: territory where you know you're kind of doing the thing you're satirizing but

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Track 3: given how little money they made on this movie it's probably good that they did.

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Track 2: They yeah and they they did it that none of it was paid for like none of the

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Track 2: product placement was paid for it it was all.

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Track 3: Really they didn't get any money for none.

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Track 2: Of it they didn't ask They just.

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Track 3: Did it. Oh, so they just did it.

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Track 1: They just did it. They were just going to advertise Frappuccino for free.

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Track 2: That's wild. None of the product placement in the movie was requested from the

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Track 2: companies. It was all just done at will by the director. They just did it.

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Track 3: Wow.

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Track 3: Okay, well, then at least, you know, they are somewhat ideologically consistent.

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Track 1: Can I also comment, one of my favorite moments in the very, like,

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Track 1: first, boy, the du jour band, is when they're on the plane, and they say that

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Track 1: the little monkey's name is Dr. Zayas.

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Track 1: And the only thing I could think of was, like, if they, like,

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Track 1: the Simpsons clip is just, like, playing in my head, like, the whole time I'm

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Track 1: watching, I'm like, Dr. Zayas, Dr.

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Track 3: Zayas. Of course.

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Track 1: And then what happens is the band members get into a fight, and they realize

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Track 1: that they've now sort of uncovered a tape that sort of uncovers a plot that

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Track 1: we don't get privy to at the moment.

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Track 1: And that Wyatt, who is their sort of the record label executive played by Alan

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Track 1: Cumming, they make the joke about—he makes the joke before he tells the pilot

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Track 1: something, and then they jump off the plane.

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Track 3: Oh, he says to shove it to the levy.

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Track 1: Yeah, to shove it to the levy.

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Track 3: It's been a really long time. This still feels like too soon. That's so mean.

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Track 2: I know.

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Track 1: It is.

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Track 2: It's brutal. Well, how about Smells Like Teen Spirit?

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Track 3: Yeah.

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Track 2: As they take that girl away.

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Track 3: Yeah.

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Track 1: Yeah.

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Track 3: Yeah, there are a lot of cute little...

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Track 3: throwaway sort of.

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Track 1: Thing so i mean essentially they're like we we have to kill this

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Track 1: band also sort of being like well there's nothing we can do we just have to

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Track 1: kill them you know or presumably killing them spoilers and they are you know

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Track 1: then why it is like tasked with finding a new band they're like okay there's

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Track 1: no other bands that exist in this label apparently you know how many backups they just have the.

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Track 3: One that's what i was thinking about when i watched it again today i was like

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Track 3: don't they have any other band they're just representing the one yeah.

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Track 2: No it's just.

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Track 3: Like boys band and now the girl group or.

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Track 1: Girl band. There's always like the backup. There's like NSYNC and there's Backstreet

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Track 1: Boys. There's always like, I don't know, you know, there's Yeah.

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Track 2: In this analogy, which of those are the backup NSYNC or Backstreet Boys?

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Track 3: Well, depends on when you're asking.

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Track 1: I mean, which one is better? Which band is better? Is that what you're asking me?

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Track 3: Oh, that's a better question.

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Track 2: This is a personal, I don't know. I'm not, I don't think I've ever listened

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Track 2: to more than like 10 seconds of any of their music.

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Track 1: I can't say that that's the same case for myself. given my like when i grew

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Track 1: up and like you know the my age we grew up.

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Track 2: At the same time you guys are like the same age.

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Track 1: Damn it i mean sorry.

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Track 2: Sorry you can't that's yeah.

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Track 1: In like in retrospect you probably would say that nsync is like the more talented

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Track 1: band just simply because of justin timberlake regardless of your feelings of

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Track 1: justin timberlake as a human probably

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Track 1: they're like they're probably a and backstreet Boys is probably B.

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Track 3: Yeah. But Backstreet Boys is like, I don't, although I don't know, I feel like they were,

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Track 3: less problematic consistently and they all just seemed like nice boys oh the

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Track 3: back yeah and sync was yeah they just see those are the one that's the one my

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Track 3: mom like she went out and bought their cd at sam goody and she got like that

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Track 3: like the millennium album came out and like we went together to get it she was so excited they.

Speaker: 00:16:57

Track 1: Came out first too they were like a couple years before in sync i feel like

Speaker: 00:17:00

Track 1: they were sort of like the original of this.

Speaker: 00:17:02

Track 3: Kind of.

Speaker: 00:17:03

Track 1: Band and then instinct was sort like grown in a lab to create,

Speaker: 00:17:07

Track 1: to like be a second, you know?

Speaker: 00:17:09

Track 2: Yeah. Justin, that's an accurate description of Justin Saber.

Speaker: 00:17:11

Track 3: Like he was a, he was a Disney kid, right? Like, wasn't he on like or something?

Speaker: 00:17:15

Track 2: Yeah.

Speaker: 00:17:16

Track 3: He was. Yeah. Um, yeah, there were, and there were a ton of those bands and

Speaker: 00:17:20

Track 3: that's why this movie, like this movie is definitely of its time.

Speaker: 00:17:23

Track 3: Like it's very specific to like, it came out in 2001 and we'll get to the whole

Speaker: 00:17:28

Track 3: pre nine 11 film thing later. Cause that is important to talk about. Um,

Speaker: 00:17:33

Track 3: This was sort of like on the tail end of the boy band craze.

Speaker: 00:17:39

Track 1: It was actually, because like big boy bands was like 96 to probably 2000.

Speaker: 00:17:44

Track 1: I feel like they were trailing off at this point and to make a movie critiquing them.

Speaker: 00:17:49

Track 1: I wonder if that plays into why it was so sort of pan.

Speaker: 00:17:51

Track 1: Like if this had come out in 99 or something, I don't know. I mean,

Speaker: 00:17:57

Track 1: maybe you couldn't have made the movie in 99 because it was like making fun

Speaker: 00:18:00

Track 1: of these bands in a way that wasn't acceptable yet. I don't know. Maybe.

Speaker: 00:18:06

Track 2: I mean.

Speaker: 00:18:07

Track 3: Sorry, I lost you for a second.

Speaker: 00:18:08

Track 1: Can you hear me still?

Speaker: 00:18:09

Track 3: Yeah. Okay. All right.

Speaker: 00:18:10

Track 1: I got you. I was just saying, like, I wonder if it couldn't.

Speaker: 00:18:14

Track 1: I mean, I don't know the production and like when there was,

Speaker: 00:18:16

Track 1: you know, when it was written and all that.

Speaker: 00:18:17

Track 1: But if they had made the movie a few years earlier, maybe they wouldn't have

Speaker: 00:18:20

Track 1: been able to because, you know, you're kind of shitting on this industry. So, yeah.

Speaker: 00:18:26

Track 3: Yeah no you might be right.

Speaker: 00:18:28

Track 2: I don't know i feel like if you're gonna make this the the people that would

Speaker: 00:18:32

Track 2: make this movie like it depends on who and your like intention like i feel like

Speaker: 00:18:36

Track 2: the the people that made this movie based on all i know about these people's this movie uh,

Speaker: 00:18:44

Track 2: i feel like they would be down to like you know,

Speaker: 00:18:49

Track 2: poke fun at that regardless of how culturally like you know dominant it was.

Speaker: 00:18:56

Track 1: Yeah it was one of the directors is deborah caplan

Speaker: 00:18:59

Track 1: and she also her the only movies

Speaker: 00:19:01

Track 1: she made before this were a very brady sequel so the second

Speaker: 00:19:04

Track 1: brady bunch movie and can't hardly wait which also had

Speaker: 00:19:07

Track 1: you know had seth green and i'm sure that played a part into why he was in this

Speaker: 00:19:11

Track 1: film but such a different take on teenagers teenage years and this is sort of

Speaker: 00:19:17

Track 1: this is what they were listening to and this is why teenagers are the way they

Speaker: 00:19:22

Track 1: are perhaps is that we have commercialized every facet of life,

Speaker: 00:19:27

Track 1: you know from the you know the the joke early in the on with the group of girls

Speaker: 00:19:33

Track 1: who like buy a bunch of stuff that's pink you know and red and then they have

Speaker: 00:19:36

Track 1: like a blue is a new color and i couldn't keep up with their.

Speaker: 00:19:39

Track 2: That felt very pointed at victoria's secret at that time when pink and the whole

Speaker: 00:19:46

Track 2: Victoria's Secret and pink and their targeting of teen girls of that time,

Speaker: 00:19:51

Track 2: which was like such a thing and how prevalent that was and the whole,

Speaker: 00:19:57

Track 2: all of that. Like it's just so.

Speaker: 00:19:59

Track 3: Yeah. And that was kind of, if I'm remembering correctly, through the fog of

Speaker: 00:20:03

Track 3: what felt like a gallon of that love spell spray that was in the hallways at

Speaker: 00:20:07

Track 3: my school in 2002 and beyond, you know exactly what I'm talking about. Everybody had it.

Speaker: 00:20:13

Track 3: But that was when they started the Victoria's Secret pink thing specifically

Speaker: 00:20:16

Track 3: to market to, like, teens and tweens and stuff.

Speaker: 00:20:19

Track 3: And I think it was kind of controversial, too, because it was like,

Speaker: 00:20:22

Track 3: oh, this is, like, the lingerie.

Speaker: 00:20:23

Track 2: I feel like it wasn't controversial at first. It wasn't until,

Speaker: 00:20:28

Track 2: like, a few years into it.

Speaker: 00:20:31

Track 2: And it kept going that people finally were like, wait a minute.

Speaker: 00:20:34

Track 2: This is kind of fucked up.

Speaker: 00:20:36

Track 3: It's weird.

Speaker: 00:20:37

Track 2: Like, at first, it was just like, yeah, this is, you know, it's okay.

Speaker: 00:20:40

Track 2: This is what you do. You sell things. And then like at a certain point,

Speaker: 00:20:44

Track 2: we, as a culture, like certain, there was a certain development of cultural

Speaker: 00:20:49

Track 2: sensibilities because when it started, it just seemed acceptable.

Speaker: 00:20:55

Track 2: I mean, this is at the same time with Abercrombie and Fitch and Hollister and

Speaker: 00:20:58

Track 2: all that stuff was coming up and it was so sexualized and it took a while for

Speaker: 00:21:04

Track 2: our culture as a whole to kind of like react to it.

Speaker: 00:21:07

Track 2: I'd be like, this is kind of super fucked up. Like, why are you putting teen

Speaker: 00:21:11

Track 2: boys and girls in super risque outfits on, like,

Speaker: 00:21:16

Track 2: giant posters in your store and gassing mall walkers with your stuff that you

Speaker: 00:21:24

Track 2: can smell from the other side of the mall?

Speaker: 00:21:26

Track 2: Like, why are you doing this? This seems kind of not cool.

Speaker: 00:21:29

Track 3: Yeah, and, like, the music, like, being pumped out, like, into the halls and

Speaker: 00:21:32

Track 3: it just sounds like a nightclub and stuff.

Speaker: 00:21:34

Track 3: Yeah, the whole, like, everything that was marketed to, like,

Speaker: 00:21:38

Track 3: teens and tweens back then, it seemed like it sort of pushed up the general,

Speaker: 00:21:43

Track 3: like, idea of when kids would start dressing like adults.

Speaker: 00:21:48

Track 3: Not in the way that, like, people didn't know how to dress kids,

Speaker: 00:21:51

Track 3: so they'd put them in, like, weird outfits, but, like, have,

Speaker: 00:21:53

Track 3: like, 12-year-olds dressing like 16-year-olds.

Speaker: 00:21:57

Track 3: I work in a high school, so I see kids wear anything you could possibly imagine.

Speaker: 00:22:02

Track 3: There's basically no dress code. I don't think anybody gives a shit about it.

Speaker: 00:22:05

Track 3: And I don't care because I'm like, I'm not wearing it. But there's definitely...

Speaker: 00:22:09

Track 3: Like, I feel like I can almost pinpoint when that happened because you look

Speaker: 00:22:13

Track 3: at prom pictures of like my parents or like or like people who went to prom

Speaker: 00:22:19

Track 3: in like 1989 to like 1999.

Speaker: 00:22:23

Track 3: And they were dressed like they were going to a cocktail party and the next

Speaker: 00:22:27

Track 3: day they were going to the office.

Speaker: 00:22:29

Track 3: It wasn't like the runway or anything, you know, it's just weird the way that

Speaker: 00:22:33

Track 3: fashion has changed for very younger people. Very strange.

Speaker: 00:22:36

Track 1: One thing I saw in an article I did find earlier is that part of the,

Speaker: 00:22:42

Track 1: this is not directly related to the advertising, but like it relates to how

Speaker: 00:22:46

Track 1: they were crafting the movie.

Speaker: 00:22:47

Track 1: So apparently they pitched the movie as sort of being this conspiracy kind of

Speaker: 00:22:52

Track 1: idea because, you know, they had the like grunge era of like the mid 90s of like Nirvana,

Speaker: 00:22:58

Track 1: Pearl Jam, Sonic Youth that were talking about sort of dissent against sort

Speaker: 00:23:02

Track 1: of authority and like wearing different things.

Speaker: 00:23:05

Track 1: And, you know, you look at like the movie Clues, like how people were dressing

Speaker: 00:23:07

Track 1: kind of like in that movie.

Speaker: 00:23:09

Track 1: And they're like, well, the music industry then decided to like completely course

Speaker: 00:23:14

Track 1: correct in a way. This is kind of quoting what they're saying.

Speaker: 00:23:17

Track 1: Instead, we want them to buy and promote corporate culture in a way we can't

Speaker: 00:23:22

Track 1: still have them being down with corporations. We don't want to buy your crap.

Speaker: 00:23:25

Track 1: And we actually do need you to buy our useless crap really badly.

Speaker: 00:23:30

Track 1: And so they, I mean, do you think, thinking back to that era,

Speaker: 00:23:36

Track 1: do you think that NSYNC and Backstreet Boys and those kind of bands were actually...

Speaker: 00:23:43

Track 1: being used as a way to buy a bunch of shit? I mean, maybe not to the extreme

Speaker: 00:23:47

Track 1: as this film goes, but like, do you think that they were being used to buy products

Speaker: 00:23:52

Track 1: in some way? I can't like, I'm trying to like...

Speaker: 00:23:55

Track 3: I think even if it's not intentional, which it very well could be,

Speaker: 00:23:58

Track 3: even if it's not intentional,

Speaker: 00:24:00

Track 3: a band or anybody who has a lot of influence,

Speaker: 00:24:03

Track 3: like a really famous musician or an actor, anybody

Speaker: 00:24:06

Track 3: who's getting a lot of attention is going

Speaker: 00:24:09

Track 3: to be marketing a sort of aesthetic you know if it's if it's associated with

Speaker: 00:24:13

Track 3: some sort of like whether it's the prevalent culture or like a subculture it

Speaker: 00:24:18

Track 3: doesn't have to be boy bands it could also be like punk you know like anything

Speaker: 00:24:22

Track 3: and they're tied into that because of the nature of capitalism and when just the world,

Speaker: 00:24:29

Track 3: you're marketing an aesthetic and in order

Speaker: 00:24:32

Track 3: to signify to other people that you're part of that same sort of

Speaker: 00:24:35

Track 3: subculture or the dominant culture to fit in or to stand out as a member of

Speaker: 00:24:40

Track 3: something else you're going to be buying things and adorning yourself in the

Speaker: 00:24:45

Track 3: vestments of that culture so i think yeah intentional or not they're selling

Speaker: 00:24:50

Track 3: stuff it's just there's no way around it.

Speaker: 00:24:52

Track 2: This is at the same time that hot

Speaker: 00:24:56

Track 2: topic turned and became

Speaker: 00:25:00

Track 2: hot topic has a very interesting history and

Speaker: 00:25:02

Track 2: the way it evolved and this is these years are the years in which hot topic

Speaker: 00:25:08

Track 2: became like the alt alt lifestyle became heavily marketed and hot topic while

Speaker: 00:25:16

Track 2: simultaneously like we're alt we're counterculture simultaneously was.

Speaker: 00:25:22

Track 3: Selling hand.

Speaker: 00:25:25

Track 2: Over fist that material and entering the music the music industry in a big way

Speaker: 00:25:31

Track 2: and pushing music and aligning that with their product in.

Speaker: 00:25:36

Track 3: A big way.

Speaker: 00:25:37

Track 2: This is really, you know, it's, it's, you know, it's, you are always, you know.

Speaker: 00:25:43

Track 2: They are selling an aesthetic. They're selling a lifestyle. They're selling

Speaker: 00:25:46

Track 2: a culture. And that's always part of it.

Speaker: 00:25:48

Track 2: I think it's interesting to think about though, that, that like they are saying

Speaker: 00:25:53

Track 2: this as if this is like unique to this time, because we all know that this is

Speaker: 00:25:58

Track 2: the music industry has been heavily,

Speaker: 00:26:02

Track 2: heavily commodified,

Speaker: 00:26:05

Track 2: incredibly commodified since basically the advent of radio.

Speaker: 00:26:11

Track 2: and like records, like, you know, like Elvis, the Beatles, like all of those

Speaker: 00:26:18

Track 2: people were huge commercial products.

Speaker: 00:26:23

Track 2: And it's like, we keep having this thing. And this is like, so you're like, we keep, uh,

Speaker: 00:26:28

Track 2: It reminds me of years ago, that the Winnie the Pooh movie with Ewan McGregor.

Speaker: 00:26:36

Track 2: I don't remember the name of it.

Speaker: 00:26:38

Track 2: And it's like, I remember my wife and I, we went to go see that, right?

Speaker: 00:26:41

Track 2: And in the end, he learns like, oh, you know, you have to like,

Speaker: 00:26:44

Track 2: you know, live with your family and it's not all about work.

Speaker: 00:26:47

Track 2: And it's like, we just keep making these movies with these lessons that nobody pays attention to.

Speaker: 00:26:52

Track 2: It's like, we already know this lesson.

Speaker: 00:26:55

Track 2: We've learned this lesson. Like, we have this lesson. It's not new.

Speaker: 00:26:58

Track 2: The music industry commodifies shit and like sells us culture.

Speaker: 00:27:02

Track 2: Like, you know, it's like, this is just, we're just being told that lesson again and again.

Speaker: 00:27:07

Track 2: And people don't like, you know, internalize it for obvious reasons.

Speaker: 00:27:12

Track 3: Yeah. I think if this movie, no, it's very relevant. Because honestly,

Speaker: 00:27:17

Track 3: I think if this movie was made, so this movie came out in April of 2001.

Speaker: 00:27:21

Track 3: If it came out after September of 2001, so many things about this movie would be different.

Speaker: 00:27:27

Track 1: The play part?

Speaker: 00:27:29

Track 3: Yeah that's a big one first of

Speaker: 00:27:32

Track 3: all yes sorry because they wouldn't they

Speaker: 00:27:35

Track 3: would have shelved it no they would have shelved it there were so many things that they

Speaker: 00:27:38

Track 3: cut out of movies they made they um made

Speaker: 00:27:41

Track 3: the strokes had some song that was like something about cops

Speaker: 00:27:44

Track 3: in new york and they made them take that off their album they

Speaker: 00:27:47

Track 3: cut out shots of the twin towers in movies and tv spider

Speaker: 00:27:50

Track 3: man and music and yeah music

Speaker: 00:27:54

Track 3: tv movies everything fucking

Speaker: 00:27:57

Track 3: changed after that point um aside

Speaker: 00:28:00

Track 3: from not being able to show the twin towers for like ever the

Speaker: 00:28:04

Track 3: music they were playing on the radio shifted i mean it's very obvious in country

Speaker: 00:28:07

Track 3: music but also you went from like there was a little bit of a pendulum swing

Speaker: 00:28:12

Track 3: back to the other way but as far as like the top songs like the billboard 100

Speaker: 00:28:16

Track 3: rock music kind of like that was the point at which it started just,

Speaker: 00:28:21

Track 3: completely shifting off because as well as the aesthetic like the.

Speaker: 00:28:27

Track 3: Content of a lot of rock is you know it would be political and it would be there

Speaker: 00:28:31

Track 3: would be like anti-establishment exactly and you don't you don't see that like

Speaker: 00:28:35

Track 3: you look at the billboard 100 today and there's maybe like two actual bands

Speaker: 00:28:40

Track 3: on there and they're like k-pop,

Speaker: 00:28:42

Track 3: it's like it's like boy groups which is fine like

Speaker: 00:28:44

Track 3: i don't my niece loves straight kids i'm like cool i don't

Speaker: 00:28:48

Track 3: know you're just not seeing that at all really as far as like what is part of

Speaker: 00:28:53

Track 3: the dominant culture like the billboard 100 stuff and even as recently as like

Speaker: 00:28:57

Track 3: the end of 2001 that was completely different like half of it was bands and

Speaker: 00:29:02

Track 3: now it's mostly like solo artists it's very strange even.

Speaker: 00:29:05

Track 1: In this movie if you think of i mean again i

Speaker: 00:29:08

Track 1: don't think this was maybe intentional but like the music of

Speaker: 00:29:12

Track 1: the du jour boy band like

Speaker: 00:29:15

Track 1: this very sexualized sort of song the music

Speaker: 00:29:18

Track 1: that the joe's and the pussycats makes is like

Speaker: 00:29:21

Track 1: a complete departure in terms of like the aesthetics the style i realize it's

Speaker: 00:29:25

Track 1: a women's women's group it's more punk like they change the aesthetic within

Speaker: 00:29:31

Track 1: this film which i think also is interesting that we can get to as well but um yeah it's i.

Speaker: 00:29:39

Track 2: I think K-pop is such a relevant thing, though.

Speaker: 00:29:46

Track 2: This movie and what it posits and how it presents the culture around du jour,

Speaker: 00:29:58

Track 2: but really, not even, I'm sorry, not du jour.

Speaker: 00:30:01

Track 2: What it posits is being done with Josie and the Pussycats is 100% the culture

Speaker: 00:30:11

Track 2: of K-pop, but also the marketing of K-pop.

Speaker: 00:30:16

Track 2: When Parker Posey shows those...

Speaker: 00:30:21

Track 2: Headsets and she goes you if you want

Speaker: 00:30:24

Track 2: to experience it you have to buy this my wife

Speaker: 00:30:27

Track 2: turns she goes life's the light sticks at k-pop concerts

Speaker: 00:30:30

Track 2: and it is a hundred percent what it is like k-pop has

Speaker: 00:30:34

Track 2: taken the it really

Speaker: 00:30:38

Track 2: is like it is you look at the

Speaker: 00:30:41

Track 2: fact that south korea is a little

Speaker: 00:30:44

Track 2: you know military dictatorship run

Speaker: 00:30:48

Track 2: by the united states and where the

Speaker: 00:30:51

Track 2: the united states just does its shit

Speaker: 00:30:54

Track 2: and it's like oh look they perfected capitalist commodification of art in a

Speaker: 00:31:02

Track 2: way that is so pure and inflicted upon that population and how it's coming back

Speaker: 00:31:07

Track 2: to us in a in a new way and it's like this movie like literally like predicted that.

Speaker: 00:31:14

Track 3: Yeah. No, because it's so interesting to me that when boy bands,

Speaker: 00:31:19

Track 3: I think the last really big one to hear is like One Direction.

Speaker: 00:31:23

Track 1: Yeah, probably so.

Speaker: 00:31:25

Track 3: They were like huge and now like they're like adults and like nobody fucking

Speaker: 00:31:29

Track 3: cares. I don't think they're doing anything.

Speaker: 00:31:30

Track 2: The last one here is BTS probably.

Speaker: 00:31:34

Track 3: Well, yeah, but that's the thing. It's like we're not we're not even making

Speaker: 00:31:37

Track 3: our own boy bands anymore.

Speaker: 00:31:40

Track 2: We used to be a real country.

Speaker: 00:31:42

Track 3: We used to be a proper country. Make our own boy bands.

Speaker: 00:31:47

Track 3: But it's so funny the way that that's been exported. And I was thinking about

Speaker: 00:31:52

Track 3: that when I was watching this.

Speaker: 00:31:53

Track 3: I'm like, damn. No, that's it. Because the...

Speaker: 00:31:56

Track 3: k-pop industry too it's so abusive and terrible

Speaker: 00:31:59

Track 3: like they'll force like the way they like trade like these trainee idols and

Speaker: 00:32:03

Track 3: stuff and they'll force them to perform and everything the same shit that was

Speaker: 00:32:06

Track 3: happening to britney and all the like the girl artists like the like queens

Speaker: 00:32:11

Track 3: of pop all the shit that was happening to them it's happening to fuck but it's

Speaker: 00:32:14

Track 3: like industrial scale we offshored.

Speaker: 00:32:17

Track 1: Uh we offshored boy and girl bands.

Speaker: 00:32:20

Track 2: To uh to our baby here

Speaker: 00:32:23

Track 2: it's it's boutique it's bespoke it's

Speaker: 00:32:26

Track 2: bespoke abuse there it's industrial

Speaker: 00:32:29

Track 2: it's like you start at 13 like i

Speaker: 00:32:32

Track 2: like baby metal am i like it's like wait one of them just turned like 30 i think

Speaker: 00:32:39

Track 2: and it's like oh she's been or like honestly i think it might have been younger

Speaker: 00:32:44

Track 2: it's like oh she's been around since what i mean she's like she started in like j-pop at like 13 it's.

Speaker: 00:32:51

Track 3: That's crazy it's insane i was thinking a lot about how we don't see like there's

Speaker: 00:32:55

Track 3: because we're not doing like the group band thing so much as far as like pop

Speaker: 00:32:59

Track 3: music like it's a lot of individual artists and everything and i think the reason

Speaker: 00:33:02

Track 3: and you can if you got to splice this somewhere else because you haven't gotten to this,

Speaker: 00:33:10

Track 3: Part of the reason I think they want to get rid of the other pussycats,

Speaker: 00:33:13

Track 3: aside from the fact that Val like kind of clocks the weirdness right away,

Speaker: 00:33:17

Track 3: is it's so much easier to take advantage of and abuse one person than it is

Speaker: 00:33:23

Track 3: to do to a group of people.

Speaker: 00:33:25

Track 2: Yeah, they isolate them.

Speaker: 00:33:27

Track 3: Yeah.

Speaker: 00:33:29

Track 1: And on top of that, I think it's also pressing the button of American,

Speaker: 00:33:35

Track 1: the ideal of more individualistic expression versus sort of this group expression,

Speaker: 00:33:41

Track 1: which I think actually starts early on is when he when Wyatt goes to Riverdale

Speaker: 00:33:45

Track 1: to discover then called the Pussycats.

Speaker: 00:33:48

Track 1: He immediately renames them Josie and the Pussycats and putting,

Speaker: 00:33:53

Track 1: you know, Rachel Lee Cook as sort of their lead, you know, because she's the

Speaker: 00:33:57

Track 1: singer and the guitar player is what he says.

Speaker: 00:33:59

Track 1: But again, it's this, you know, Disney has that ridiculous thing.

Speaker: 00:34:03

Track 1: It's like bands that have the

Speaker: 00:34:04

Track 1: word and in them do like 50% better than no bands. He's like, the Beatles?

Speaker: 00:34:09

Track 2: You know, you know, a music executive has said those words. You know it.

Speaker: 00:34:16

Track 1: Something to that effect or something like that putting the in front of your

Speaker: 00:34:22

Track 1: band you know that's happened.

Speaker: 00:34:23

Track 2: It goes back to dark side of the moon in

Speaker: 00:34:26

Track 2: like the pink floyd's dark side of the moon when you know in money and he's

Speaker: 00:34:30

Track 2: like oh and which one or whichever song it was i don't remember which song exactly

Speaker: 00:34:33

Track 2: it was like and which one of you is pink and it's like the the separation between

Speaker: 00:34:39

Track 2: between the artist and the industry and the people that you know produce this stuff and they're.

Speaker: 00:34:46

Track 1: Completely mega records i also

Speaker: 00:34:49

Track 1: i love that just like we're not even going to dance around the day just called

Speaker: 00:34:52

Track 1: could be we also get

Speaker: 00:34:55

Track 1: very early on so after they've discovered them and

Speaker: 00:34:58

Track 1: they like fly them out to you know which is new york city but

Speaker: 00:35:01

Track 1: it's like even more bright light and you

Speaker: 00:35:04

Track 1: know uh commercial than it actually is they show uh fiona who's played by parker

Speaker: 00:35:11

Track 1: posey sort of the ceo of the company and i love how they have like the u.s government

Speaker: 00:35:15

Track 1: is like there to visit them and then like the building floor just somehow is

Speaker: 00:35:19

Track 1: like in the elevator and then it just like lowers in the building whatever it's.

Speaker: 00:35:24

Track 3: Like you're in disney world for a second yeah it's like it's like you're in

Speaker: 00:35:26

Track 3: a haunted mansion suddenly everything's moving like what the fuck.

Speaker: 00:35:29

Track 1: And then they're like you know basically you know

Speaker: 00:35:32

Track 1: sharing with the government which they already know is that they're using

Speaker: 00:35:35

Track 1: music to subliminal messages to

Speaker: 00:35:38

Track 1: sell products which is good for the economy and blah

Speaker: 00:35:41

Track 1: blah blah and the thing that i immediately comes

Speaker: 00:35:43

Track 1: to me is i think i mentioned maybe to both of you is like mk ultra

Speaker: 00:35:47

Track 1: and like that's where i think of like

Speaker: 00:35:49

Track 1: the movie they live and sort of like this this commercial stuff

Speaker: 00:35:53

Track 1: that's sort of hidden within the cracks but probably thinking

Speaker: 00:35:56

Track 1: back to 2001 going back to that conversation is i feel like soon after 9-11

Speaker: 00:36:02

Track 1: wasn't there like the big push by bush be like go shopping again like go buy

Speaker: 00:36:07

Track 1: stuff because yep the economy had been suffering and now you got to go buy stuff

Speaker: 00:36:11

Track 1: to do your due diligence you know due diligence, do your duty as like an American.

Speaker: 00:36:15

Track 1: And I feel like this plays that up to just like 11.

Speaker: 00:36:19

Track 3: Yeah.

Speaker: 00:36:19

Track 3: Yeah, you're contributing to the economy. You're being a good citizen by shopping

Speaker: 00:36:23

Track 3: and consuming as much as you can. Because if you don't shop, who will?

Speaker: 00:36:27

Track 3: Who's going to buy that orange shirt from the shitty guy? Yeah,

Speaker: 00:36:31

Track 3: from the shitty guy at the Steve Madden store.

Speaker: 00:36:33

Track 1: The new pink. Oh, yeah, orange is the new pink, right.

Speaker: 00:36:36

Track 3: Yeah, orange is the new pink.

Speaker: 00:36:38

Track 1: Does orange ever a popular cover? I don't think so.

Speaker: 00:36:41

Track 2: In the 1970s.

Speaker: 00:36:42

Track 3: For a very brief time.

Speaker: 00:36:43

Track 1: Oh, okay.

Speaker: 00:36:43

Track 3: And also, like, for a little bit, like, maybe after Fifth Element came out.

Speaker: 00:36:47

Track 2: It's probably a thing.

Speaker: 00:36:48

Track 1: Yeah.

Speaker: 00:36:49

Track 2: Deep cut. I don't think so. I don't think Fifth Element was moving the cultural needle.

Speaker: 00:36:56

Track 1: For me, it was.

Speaker: 00:36:57

Track 3: It was for me.

Speaker: 00:36:58

Track 2: Yeah. No, we all can agree, for us, it was moving things, but I don't think

Speaker: 00:37:05

Track 2: it was largely moving the cultural needle.

Speaker: 00:37:09

Track 1: I'm sorry. According to my calculations, the GDP went up 0.1% after Fifth Element

Speaker: 00:37:14

Track 1: came out. That's just a fact. Sorry.

Speaker: 00:37:16

Track 3: Yeah, you can't argue with numbers.

Speaker: 00:37:18

Track 1: According to ChatGPT, he told me that. So for those listening,

Speaker: 00:37:21

Track 1: I didn't actually use ChatGPT.

Speaker: 00:37:23

Track 3: And think about how often you eat noodles.

Speaker: 00:37:26

Track 2: I'm not denying the power of the fifth element, okay? Not denying that. Super green.

Speaker: 00:37:35

Track 1: I mean, the thing that's also funny is the government is, like,

Speaker: 00:37:38

Track 1: okay with people using it to sell records.

Speaker: 00:37:41

Track 1: Like, wouldn't they have been wanting to put things in the music,

Speaker: 00:37:45

Track 1: like, you know, enlist in the military and, you know, stuff that actually helped them? Oh, did they?

Speaker: 00:37:50

Track 2: They did at the end.

Speaker: 00:37:50

Track 1: Did I miss that?

Speaker: 00:37:51

Track 2: In the movie.

Speaker: 00:37:51

Track 3: At the end.

Speaker: 00:37:52

Track 2: When they made the joke about how subliminal messages are better in movies, it literally said.

Speaker: 00:37:58

Track 1: Right. Oh, right. Yes. On the screen.

Speaker: 00:37:59

Track 2: What is it? Join the army or something like that?

Speaker: 00:38:01

Track 1: Yeah.

Speaker: 00:38:01

Track 3: I do want to mention that just a few months before this is when the Simpsons

Speaker: 00:38:07

Track 3: episode 12, or sorry, season 12, episode 14 came out, which was New Kids on

Speaker: 00:38:12

Track 3: the Blech, which is where they have the boy band, the Ivan Etniage episode.

Speaker: 00:38:16

Track 1: That was in my notes.

Speaker: 00:38:17

Track 2: This is when I check out.

Speaker: 00:38:18

Track 3: This is crazy. I can't. I can't talk to you. Listen, Evan. I'm reading those,

Speaker: 00:38:25

Track 3: Mike. You know what I'm talking about.

Speaker: 00:38:28

Track 3: That's so, it's so crazy. I didn't realize it came out like right before. That's nuts.

Speaker: 00:38:32

Track 1: And for those listeners who don't know this episode, like there is a boy band,

Speaker: 00:38:36

Track 1: which is like Bart and Nelson, and they use like an auto tuner to basically

Speaker: 00:38:41

Track 1: make their, like they can't sing actually.

Speaker: 00:38:43

Track 1: And so like all of a sudden they can sing. And it was basically to recruit people for the Navy.

Speaker: 00:38:47

Track 3: Yeah.

Speaker: 00:38:48

Track 1: Like the entire thing was subliminal messaging to get people.

Speaker: 00:38:50

Track 1: Like they film, I think they do like a music video on like a naval ship maybe

Speaker: 00:38:55

Track 1: or something. I don't know. It's been a while since they've seen this.

Speaker: 00:38:57

Track 3: They're in like the desert or something too. It's very weird.

Speaker: 00:39:00

Track 2: I really appreciate that. That information download on that.

Speaker: 00:39:03

Track 1: My brain thinks in like three ways like simpsons episodes uh i can't remember

Speaker: 00:39:09

Track 1: the other two because that one's um pushing that one takes.

Speaker: 00:39:12

Track 3: Up a lot of space yeah.

Speaker: 00:39:13

Track 1: No you're.

Speaker: 00:39:14

Track 3: In good company we know you're good.

Speaker: 00:39:17

Track 1: Well the like what was i gonna say is the we didn't really talk specifically

Speaker: 00:39:22

Track 1: about the character like i don't want to say characters the actors and like

Speaker: 00:39:26

Track 1: the the i guess the characters in the film that are in the Josie and the Pussycats.

Speaker: 00:39:32

Track 1: We have Rachel Lee Cook is Josie, and then Tara Reid plays Melody,

Speaker: 00:39:36

Track 1: and then Rosario Dawson plays Valerie.

Speaker: 00:39:38

Track 1: And I think I can speak for everyone when I say that they nailed the casting.

Speaker: 00:39:44

Track 3: Oh, absolutely. That's so good. So good. I want good things for Tara Reid.

Speaker: 00:39:48

Track 3: I don't know what she has going on now.

Speaker: 00:39:51

Track 1: I don't think it's too good. I think not very much.

Speaker: 00:39:53

Track 3: Yeah, I don't think it's too good. But she did such a good job.

Speaker: 00:39:57

Track 3: But I love Rosario Dawson very much.

Speaker: 00:39:59

Track 1: I think they're probably I think I joked in another episode how many different

Speaker: 00:40:03

Track 1: American Pie movies there have been but there's been like four or five and I

Speaker: 00:40:07

Track 1: think the most recent one was like they had a wedding and then I said like they're

Speaker: 00:40:11

Track 1: going to make one soon where like one of them has a baby or something I don't know like.

Speaker: 00:40:14

Track 2: Which also American Baby. Eugene Levy, another American Pie also in this.

Speaker: 00:40:18

Track 3: Yeah yeah that's right and you know what him and Parker Posey there's some overlap

Speaker: 00:40:22

Track 3: with Christopher Guest stuff too.

Speaker: 00:40:24

Track 1: That's right yeah.

Speaker: 00:40:25

Track 3: Yeah.

Speaker: 00:40:26

Track 1: I have to think that like the, maybe not Parker Posey, but like Eugene Levy

Speaker: 00:40:30

Track 1: being in this was almost, I don't want to say it like a favor to someone,

Speaker: 00:40:32

Track 1: but like, hey, can you do this ridiculous commercial, not commercial,

Speaker: 00:40:35

Track 1: this ridiculous training video or whatever you want to call it, promotional video?

Speaker: 00:40:40

Track 2: That's exactly the kind of stuff Eugene Levy has always done.

Speaker: 00:40:42

Track 1: That's true. He'll do anything.

Speaker: 00:40:43

Track 2: Like, Eugene Levy is not, you know, like, listen, like, Eugene Levy is an amazing

Speaker: 00:40:47

Track 2: actor with an amazing body of work, but Eugene Levy is not Brad Pitt or George Clooney.

Speaker: 00:40:52

Track 2: Like, Eugene Levy is a character actor. Yes. But, like, Eugene Levy is a character

Speaker: 00:40:56

Track 2: actor that, like, he's, he's like Michael Caine.

Speaker: 00:41:00

Track 2: Like, he does things because, like, he's an actor and it's his job and he enjoys it.

Speaker: 00:41:06

Track 2: Like, and he has bills to pay, you know?

Speaker: 00:41:08

Track 2: Like, Michael Caine has said, he's like, I, I, I approach everything,

Speaker: 00:41:12

Track 2: you know, like, it's like why did you do this because i had a mortgage like

Speaker: 00:41:15

Track 2: yeah like literally that's an answer has.

Speaker: 00:41:19

Track 3: Eugene levy been in a muppet thing.

Speaker: 00:41:22

Track 2: Well i mean eugene levy is actually a i believe eugene levy is actually a muppet so that's.

Speaker: 00:41:28

Track 3: Why guys have never seen them in the same room.

Speaker: 00:41:30

Track 2: At the same.

Speaker: 00:41:30

Track 1: Time so if there's a movie where like everyone is a muppet except for one actor

Speaker: 00:41:34

Track 1: it couldn't be eugene levy because he would.

Speaker: 00:41:36

Track 2: Just be one of the he's a muppet well.

Speaker: 00:41:38

Track 3: Where's the human yeah.

Speaker: 00:41:39

Track 2: Yeah you know like where's.

Speaker: 00:41:41

Track 3: The guy yeah.

Speaker: 00:41:42

Track 2: Schitt's creek is just it's what if you had a sitcom and everybody is a human

Speaker: 00:41:46

Track 2: except for one muppet that's that's schitt's creek right.

Speaker: 00:41:52

Track 3: That's so good.

Speaker: 00:41:53

Track 1: Oh boy i mean like i love that he like plays himself too it's like it just here is.

Speaker: 00:41:59

Track 2: You tell us.

Speaker: 00:42:00

Track 1: Why and you know like what is he doesn't during his little thing he asked someone

Speaker: 00:42:03

Track 1: to like get him a drink too and it's like the wrong.

Speaker: 00:42:05

Track 2: Drink i.

Speaker: 00:42:06

Track 1: Feel like that's like a very Eugene Levy thing to do I mean I'm sure.

Speaker: 00:42:10

Track 2: He's not.

Speaker: 00:42:10

Track 1: Actually a mean guy I'm sure he's a really nice guy.

Speaker: 00:42:12

Track 2: I mean Eugene Levy is also like he's an improv actor and like that's the kind

Speaker: 00:42:16

Track 2: of like historically like improv people are the most like ego bound you know

Speaker: 00:42:21

Track 2: like they are willing you know like that's no who could you be exactly I've done improv.

Speaker: 00:42:26

Track 3: It's you have to really just not give a shit and also just,

Speaker: 00:42:30

Track 3: Not take yourself too seriously.

Speaker: 00:42:32

Track 2: Yeah, exactly.

Speaker: 00:42:33

Track 1: Yeah, that's true.

Speaker: 00:42:34

Track 2: I'm not really... It's just interesting, but also like Tara Reade.

Speaker: 00:42:37

Track 2: Like Tara Reade came to this because of American Pie, and they didn't even audition

Speaker: 00:42:41

Track 2: her. They're just like, we liked her in that. Come on.

Speaker: 00:42:44

Track 3: Yeah. They nailed it.

Speaker: 00:42:45

Track 1: Yeah.

Speaker: 00:42:46

Track 3: I also don't think... Just for a second to go back to 9-11.

Speaker: 00:42:51

Track 3: If this movie was made after 9-11, I'm not certain it would be.

Speaker: 00:42:54

Track 3: There's no way the United States government would be the villain.

Speaker: 00:42:57

Track 2: Absolutely.

Speaker: 00:42:58

Track 3: It would be like, it would be like Iraq somehow or China, or if it was made

Speaker: 00:43:03

Track 3: now Russia for some reason, Russia or China. Yeah.

Speaker: 00:43:06

Track 1: Yeah. They're trying to program Americans to believe that like,

Speaker: 00:43:11

Track 1: insert, yeah, insert something absurd.

Speaker: 00:43:14

Track 2: It would be France.

Speaker: 00:43:15

Track 3: It would be the French.

Speaker: 00:43:16

Track 2: Yeah. It would be France.

Speaker: 00:43:17

Track 1: When in doubt, blame the French.

Speaker: 00:43:19

Track 2: But you know, I think it's a really good point. Cause like, I,

Speaker: 00:43:23

Track 2: I, I think, you know, especially as like someone who's like a little like older, sometimes it's,

Speaker: 00:43:30

Track 2: is easy to miss that kind of thing. Cause it's like, I have such like a history

Speaker: 00:43:36

Track 2: of like things prior to that.

Speaker: 00:43:38

Track 2: And it's like, that is what I grew up with. That's what shaped me in a lot of ways.

Speaker: 00:43:42

Track 2: And so like, sometimes like I miss quite how starkly things change.

Speaker: 00:43:47

Track 2: Cause I'm still, I'm still looking back at so much.

Speaker: 00:43:51

Track 2: And then you look forward and it's like, oh yeah, that's like,

Speaker: 00:43:55

Track 2: you're a hundred percent right.

Speaker: 00:43:55

Track 2: They would not, the U S government would not have been the villain because,

Speaker: 00:44:00

Track 2: Because, I mean, the Dixie Chicks got canceled, literally.

Speaker: 00:44:03

Track 2: The Dixie Chicks are the only people who have ever actually been the victims

Speaker: 00:44:06

Track 2: of cancel culture, okay?

Speaker: 00:44:08

Track 2: And because they said a bad thing about George W. B. Bush. And by bad thing.

Speaker: 00:44:13

Track 1: I mean correct thing. I think the villain would have been North Korea for some reason.

Speaker: 00:44:17

Track 1: Like, they're using it to soften Americans to, I don't know,

Speaker: 00:44:22

Track 1: something. They would have thought of something.

Speaker: 00:44:23

Track 2: I think it would have been a nameless, nebulous, quote-unquote,

Speaker: 00:44:29

Track 2: Middle Eastern country, and it would have been a person in just the most racist attire.

Speaker: 00:44:37

Track 1: Iraqistan.

Speaker: 00:44:38

Track 2: Racist accent. That's what I think it would have been.

Speaker: 00:44:41

Track 3: If they made it now, it would be the deep state, and it wouldn't be making people

Speaker: 00:44:45

Track 3: buy things. It would be making them gay. Communists.

Speaker: 00:44:49

Track 2: No, that would be if Ben Shapiro's production company made it.

Speaker: 00:44:53

Track 1: I think that Rachel Lee Cook and Rosario Dawson were doing that on their own.

Speaker: 00:44:59

Track 1: I don't think they needed any support to make people gay.

Speaker: 00:45:02

Track 2: Making people gay? Rachel Lee Cook did not make me gay. Quite the opposite.

Speaker: 00:45:07

Track 3: Well, maybe not you.

Speaker: 00:45:09

Track 2: Yeah, I'm just saying it wasn't universal.

Speaker: 00:45:13

Track 1: 50, it's six one way happens in the other.

Speaker: 00:45:16

Track 3: About half of the population.

Speaker: 00:45:18

Track 2: Yeah.

Speaker: 00:45:18

Track 1: Yeah. I mean, which one of you, I was talking to you both separately about this.

Speaker: 00:45:23

Track 1: Which one of you mentioned sort of like the chemistry also between Rachel A.

Speaker: 00:45:28

Track 1: Cook and Rosario Dawson in the film?

Speaker: 00:45:30

Track 2: That would have been me.

Speaker: 00:45:31

Track 3: It was a little like...

Speaker: 00:45:34

Track 3: what's happening here?

Speaker: 00:45:35

Track 2: The sexual tension between Rosario Dawson and Rachel A. Cook in this movie was

Speaker: 00:45:40

Track 2: thick enough to cut with a chainsaw. Especially in the beginning.

Speaker: 00:45:44

Track 2: There were times when Rosario Dawson, and it was all one way.

Speaker: 00:45:49

Track 2: The way Rosario Dawson looked at Rachel A. Cook in this movie was intense.

Speaker: 00:45:53

Track 3: She never looked at Cory Booker that way. I'm going to say right now. No. I never saw it.

Speaker: 00:45:58

Track 2: No.

Speaker: 00:46:01

Track 2: That scene when they're in there truly bizarre looking house and she takes Rachel

Speaker: 00:46:07

Track 2: LeCook and sits her on her lap. I was like, what the fuck is happening?

Speaker: 00:46:11

Track 1: I've had that friend. Tara Reid falls down. She sits down and falls on the ground.

Speaker: 00:46:15

Track 1: Poor Tara Reid. I mean, I feel a little bit bad for her. They just make her

Speaker: 00:46:18

Track 1: just like the dummy in pretty much all the movies she's in.

Speaker: 00:46:22

Track 2: I do think it was a major, there was a huge comedic beat loss when they did

Speaker: 00:46:28

Track 2: that bit when it was like the thoughts of the three of them,

Speaker: 00:46:32

Track 2: and rachel lee cook's like why is everybody looking at

Speaker: 00:46:35

Track 2: me blah blah blah blah and the rosario dawson's like of course they all look

Speaker: 00:46:39

Track 2: at her and then uh tara reed is like if you're happy and you know clap your

Speaker: 00:46:43

Track 2: hands and i really think it was a major failure to just they should just had

Speaker: 00:46:46

Track 2: wind just hollow wind like.

Speaker: 00:46:55

Track 1: The simpsons with like the little like.

Speaker: 00:46:57

Track 2: Monkey yeah monkey Yeah.

Speaker: 00:47:00

Track 3: Yeah. The monkey with symbols. Yeah.

Speaker: 00:47:03

Track 1: Listeners, there'll be no less than seven more Simpsons references this episode. Sorry.

Speaker: 00:47:08

Track 2: And none of which I will get.

Speaker: 00:47:11

Track 1: That's okay.

Speaker: 00:47:14

Track 2: Listen, listeners, I'm a Futurama fan, okay? Not a Simpsons fan, all right?

Speaker: 00:47:19

Track 3: Oh, I'm a Futurama fan, too.

Speaker: 00:47:20

Track 1: You can't be both.

Speaker: 00:47:22

Track 3: But they didn't do this. Yeah.

Speaker: 00:47:27

Track 1: Yeah well the the like so i

Speaker: 00:47:30

Track 1: was also thinking about like so two things one the soundtrack for the movie

Speaker: 00:47:34

Track 1: is awesome just generally but like the song that the band that josey pussycast

Speaker: 00:47:39

Track 1: has is like pretend to be nice and then of course has all those supplemental

Speaker: 00:47:43

Track 1: messages where they're listening to it back and she's like i could really go

Speaker: 00:47:45

Track 1: go for a big mac and like you're a vegetarian,

Speaker: 00:47:48

Track 1: it's like well can we just stop on the way back for a big mac and then she's

Speaker: 00:47:53

Track 1: like can i get a pair of Pumas or something.

Speaker: 00:47:55

Track 1: And I mean, again, I think I was talking about sort of like the difference in

Speaker: 00:47:58

Track 1: the bands and sort of this like sexual song versus this one.

Speaker: 00:48:02

Track 1: It's sort of the opposite of that in a way.

Speaker: 00:48:05

Track 1: And I sort of think about like the women groups from that time,

Speaker: 00:48:09

Track 1: like Britney Spears too.

Speaker: 00:48:10

Track 1: It was not the kind of songs that those bands were like coming out with.

Speaker: 00:48:14

Track 1: They all, they're all were very sort of a lot of them sexualized women and themselves,

Speaker: 00:48:18

Track 1: you know, because that's what executives wanted and that's what the people demanded

Speaker: 00:48:23

Track 1: per the record companies.

Speaker: 00:48:25

Track 1: Whereas their song is very much not that kind of song, which in my mind is sort

Speaker: 00:48:29

Track 1: of an intentional maybe way of showing that.

Speaker: 00:48:32

Track 1: I mean, maybe the better way to do it was for it to be super sexual,

Speaker: 00:48:36

Track 1: but then maybe their way of their thinking is this is sort of, this is a satire.

Speaker: 00:48:40

Track 1: You know, this is critiquing that. So I don't know. Maybe I'm thinking way too much into it.

Speaker: 00:48:44

Track 3: I think um i think it kind of captures

Speaker: 00:48:48

Track 3: the vibe of like what a girl band

Speaker: 00:48:51

Track 3: would be at that point because they were doing like girl groups

Speaker: 00:48:54

Track 3: like they'd had that show pop star where they put together um do

Speaker: 00:48:58

Track 3: you remember eden's crush they were a thing for like not very long

Speaker: 00:49:00

Track 3: at all um but there were some other there were

Speaker: 00:49:03

Track 3: like girl groups like 3lw was one

Speaker: 00:49:06

Track 3: um and they would sing about relationship stuff but it was mostly like i love

Speaker: 00:49:13

Track 3: you be nicer to me or like like hey fuck you i'm not gonna hang out with you

Speaker: 00:49:17

Track 3: anymore you're not good enough for me but it wasn't yeah it wasn't very sexual

Speaker: 00:49:21

Track 3: over usually there was a distinct difference.

Speaker: 00:49:24

Track 2: Between the content of solo female artists at the time versus,

Speaker: 00:49:33

Track 2: like female groups, like a distinct difference.

Speaker: 00:49:36

Track 1: True. Yeah, I think you're right.

Speaker: 00:49:37

Track 2: But I do think it is an interesting choice to make, because this is still a

Speaker: 00:49:43

Track 2: movie and they could still do whatever they want.

Speaker: 00:49:46

Track 2: It's still an interesting choice to make that decision to have that be the content

Speaker: 00:49:51

Track 2: because it does, it does play into the notion, the,

Speaker: 00:49:57

Track 2: the subtext of the movie of being count

Speaker: 00:50:01

Track 2: you know counter to these things and you know this and

Speaker: 00:50:04

Track 2: pushing back on uh compliance with

Speaker: 00:50:08

Track 2: things it does you know it's like they by

Speaker: 00:50:12

Track 2: having them their song be like that it

Speaker: 00:50:15

Track 2: does in the end give them that hero moment where when they're singing that song

Speaker: 00:50:20

Track 2: it's like it pushes back and it puts them very firmly in the position of these

Speaker: 00:50:25

Track 2: are the antagonists these of the heroes and they are you know rejecting the

Speaker: 00:50:29

Track 2: message that the the villains of the movie are selling exactly.

Speaker: 00:50:33

Track 3: Because like it so as far as we know like du jour the only reason anybody likes

Speaker: 00:50:37

Track 3: them is because they have that track underneath that says like listen to du

Speaker: 00:50:40

Track 3: jour and it's mr movie phone it's like you love du jour you want to buy all

Speaker: 00:50:43

Track 3: the du jour shit i love and they do the same thing it's so funny it's mr movie

Speaker: 00:50:47

Track 3: phone which oh my god is he dead.

Speaker: 00:50:50

Track 2: No okay.

Speaker: 00:50:54

Track 3: Well i hope not But anyway, as far as we know, it's the only reason anybody liked DuJour.

Speaker: 00:50:58

Track 3: I mean, the song is hilarious, but who knows if it would have done as well if not for that.

Speaker: 00:51:04

Track 3: But I think it's supposed to underline... Good. Oh, thank God. Well, that's a relief.

Speaker: 00:51:14

Track 3: It kind of underlines the whole idea that like Josie and the Pussycats,

Speaker: 00:51:18

Track 3: the Pussycats are very, they're authentic and they're just, they're artists

Speaker: 00:51:22

Track 3: and they want to make music and they, they are talented and they should have had a shot.

Speaker: 00:51:26

Track 3: They just got caught up in this shitty thing just by chance.

Speaker: 00:51:30

Track 1: Yeah.

Speaker: 00:51:31

Track 3: But it was still like what they, their authentic selves and their music and

Speaker: 00:51:35

Track 3: what they care about is still, it still resonates with people.

Speaker: 00:51:37

Track 3: They don't need all that.

Speaker: 00:51:39

Track 2: Because that is the, like, if they had them sing those songs,

Speaker: 00:51:43

Track 2: that would completely and utterly undermine the point of the movie.

Speaker: 00:51:49

Track 2: Because it really is, like, what they are saying in the movie,

Speaker: 00:51:52

Track 2: that, like, people with talent deserve to be recognized for their talent.

Speaker: 00:51:57

Track 2: And it's like, if you do that, then it's like...

Speaker: 00:52:01

Track 2: you're not telling that story you're you're saying like you know listen you

Speaker: 00:52:05

Track 2: should commodify music but don't you know but don't put subliminal messages

Speaker: 00:52:07

Track 2: underneath it you know right.

Speaker: 00:52:09

Track 1: Well and part of like when you

Speaker: 00:52:12

Track 1: look i can i don't need to read the lyrics of the song but part of the the

Speaker: 00:52:15

Track 1: song too is i think is josie's you

Speaker: 00:52:19

Track 1: know like the love interest what is it alan m i

Speaker: 00:52:22

Track 1: think is a character's name in the film he's sort

Speaker: 00:52:25

Track 1: of like this you know uh acoustic guitar

Speaker: 00:52:29

Track 1: you know solo act and you know he keeps being

Speaker: 00:52:32

Track 1: blocked from seeing her she keeps getting blocked from seeing

Speaker: 00:52:35

Track 1: her by the executive the studio executive but the

Speaker: 00:52:38

Track 1: song is very much seems to be like i just want to be like a good person and

Speaker: 00:52:42

Track 1: be with this guy you know why can't you let me be with him and then you know

Speaker: 00:52:46

Track 1: lo and behold during the they're like big concert performance after everything

Speaker: 00:52:50

Track 1: is kind of revealed he gets crowd surfed across and sort of they are together so why.

Speaker: 00:52:55

Track 2: Is he miked up during that performance.

Speaker: 00:52:57

Track 3: Yeah, how are they hearing each other?

Speaker: 00:52:59

Track 1: That is crazy. That is a great point.

Speaker: 00:53:03

Track 2: It's not even like how are they hearing... He is clearly mic'd up.

Speaker: 00:53:07

Track 3: And she walks away. Yeah, she walks away from the mic. Maybe he just never gave

Speaker: 00:53:11

Track 3: it back after his bar thing that nobody came to.

Speaker: 00:53:14

Track 2: And then connected it to the stadium sound system.

Speaker: 00:53:17

Track 3: Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker: 00:53:19

Track 1: You've just destroyed the magic of this film, Bill.

Speaker: 00:53:24

Track 3: Suspension of disbelief Everything was so realistic until that moment.

Speaker: 00:53:27

Track 2: I literally, when we were watching it, like, we both said, I was like,

Speaker: 00:53:31

Track 2: how, how is he mic'd? Like, what the fuck is happening?

Speaker: 00:53:35

Track 2: Like, and then he got on stage and reserved us and tried to get in between them.

Speaker: 00:53:41

Track 3: Yeah. She, well, she gave him, she gave him some time, but then she was like,

Speaker: 00:53:45

Track 3: all right, hey, hi. No, we're doing a concert right now.

Speaker: 00:53:48

Track 2: So, I'm here. I'm here.

Speaker: 00:53:50

Track 3: Get over there.

Speaker: 00:53:52

Track 1: There are a couple of other,

Speaker: 00:53:54

Track 1: A couple other scenes that I think are amazing that we have to talk about.

Speaker: 00:53:57

Track 1: One is, so, like, you mentioned earlier how, like, they're trying to separate the band.

Speaker: 00:54:00

Track 1: And so they take, you know, Tara Reid and Rosario Dawson and they send them

Speaker: 00:54:03

Track 1: to be on, like, Total Request Live.

Speaker: 00:54:05

Track 1: And they actually get Carson Daly to, like, kill them, which I think is incredible that he did it.

Speaker: 00:54:12

Track 2: No, I'm sorry. But it starts with the fact that they're on the fakest looking set ever.

Speaker: 00:54:22

Track 1: Cardboard cutouts of people.

Speaker: 00:54:23

Track 2: It says TRL with masking tape.

Speaker: 00:54:27

Track 3: Yeah.

Speaker: 00:54:30

Track 1: And they're like, I think there's something that's wrong with this set.

Speaker: 00:54:33

Track 2: Part of it, this movie, the choices in this movie are absolutely comedy gold.

Speaker: 00:54:44

Track 2: Yeah. Some of the cardboard cutouts in that audience are them.

Speaker: 00:54:50

Track 3: Yeah, some of them are. Like there's at least a couple of Carson Daly's.

Speaker: 00:54:53

Track 3: There's a Matt Damon, of course. Yeah. It's just, Oh my God.

Speaker: 00:54:58

Track 1: I also do like that. They got that guy. I think his name is like,

Speaker: 00:55:01

Track 1: um, uh, like Aries Spears.

Speaker: 00:55:05

Track 1: He was on the, the, he was on like mad TV back in the late nineties.

Speaker: 00:55:09

Track 1: Like he was like, this is probably his heyday in some ways. Comedian.

Speaker: 00:55:12

Track 1: And like, I like his like impression of, of, you know, Carson Daly.

Speaker: 00:55:17

Track 1: And then he's like, the nail polish.

Speaker: 00:55:19

Track 1: And then, yeah.

Speaker: 00:55:22

Track 1: That scene is just...

Speaker: 00:55:25

Track 1: It's so wacky that I just, I'm like, good job, guys.

Speaker: 00:55:31

Track 3: When he does the Cosby impression, that's a lot more unsettling now.

Speaker: 00:55:36

Track 2: Right? In retrospect. Oh, my God. So much darker. So much darker now. Holy shit.

Speaker: 00:55:44

Track 3: It's not, either ages poorly or very well. I can't decide. But it's, yeah, it's a lot.

Speaker: 00:55:49

Track 2: What exactly does he say as Cosby?

Speaker: 00:55:51

Track 3: He's like, I'm going to kill you.

Speaker: 00:55:53

Track 2: It's something.

Speaker: 00:55:53

Track 3: A spoon in the pudding.

Speaker: 00:55:55

Track 2: I'm going to stick my spoon in your pudding.

Speaker: 00:55:58

Track 1: Oh, yeah.

Speaker: 00:55:58

Track 3: More or less.

Speaker: 00:55:59

Track 1: That's very, very unfortunate.

Speaker: 00:56:01

Track 3: Gross. Yeah. It's really, it's really gross.

Speaker: 00:56:03

Track 2: That's what the lady's saying.

Speaker: 00:56:04

Track 3: But the face he makes while he's doing it is funny.

Speaker: 00:56:06

Track 2: Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker: 00:56:06

Track 1: There actually isn't a ton of this that I would say like doesn't,

Speaker: 00:56:09

Track 1: like there's a lot of movies from the two thousands that just you watch them

Speaker: 00:56:12

Track 1: now and it's very cringeworthy the whole time.

Speaker: 00:56:15

Track 1: Other than that, there isn't anything that's like really sticks out to me as.

Speaker: 00:56:19

Track 2: That's not even like, that is not even cringeworthy.

Speaker: 00:56:23

Track 2: That, that, that, that, that, didn't not age well because of the

Speaker: 00:56:26

Track 2: movie that true i mean and it's like it

Speaker: 00:56:29

Track 2: didn't age poorly it's just like it makes

Speaker: 00:56:32

Track 2: you reflect on a change in things which is wholly independent of the movie like

Speaker: 00:56:36

Track 2: you know and it wasn't even like it's not even like it's not like most most

Speaker: 00:56:40

Track 2: things like this were like oh they made a terrible homophobic joke like this

Speaker: 00:56:44

Track 2: is right he just made an impersonation of a person who we found out was a horrible fucking person.

Speaker: 00:56:50

Track 1: That's true. That is true. But I will say, the point stands that the movie doesn't

Speaker: 00:56:55

Track 1: really use disgusting and crude humor to get across jokes.

Speaker: 00:57:04

Track 3: Usually you can almost depend on a movie or a show from this time from dropping

Speaker: 00:57:08

Track 3: the R word, and they don't say it once.

Speaker: 00:57:10

Track 2: Or even like, that's gay. Not a single moment in this movie is there ever a

Speaker: 00:57:16

Track 2: homophobic comment, ever. Which is shocking for a movie at this time.

Speaker: 00:57:20

Track 1: Yeah, that's that alone should rocket this to the top of everyone's.

Speaker: 00:57:25

Track 3: You know, it's kind of a moment right now, though. Like, I know I was talking

Speaker: 00:57:29

Track 3: about it online the other day. I've been seeing a lot of people talk about this movie.

Speaker: 00:57:32

Track 1: I mean, I think, I mean, we talked about a lot about like the corporatization

Speaker: 00:57:36

Track 1: and the commercial aspect of it, but I think that's what makes it so relevant

Speaker: 00:57:42

Track 1: now is that we still are getting,

Speaker: 00:57:44

Track 1: I mean, I sort of liken this to the idea of all these, you know,

Speaker: 00:57:49

Track 1: in like the movie today would be, you know, I think of that scene from Truman

Speaker: 00:57:55

Track 1: Show where like she's holding up like the thing of Coco.

Speaker: 00:57:58

Track 1: I don't know if you know what scene I'm talking about. And she's like just speaking to nobody.

Speaker: 00:58:02

Track 1: And Jim Carrey's like, who are you talking to? Who are you selling this product?

Speaker: 00:58:06

Track 1: And I think about that too with, you know, TikTok creators and Instagram,

Speaker: 00:58:09

Track 1: you know, creators, these huge followings that are just hawking all kinds of

Speaker: 00:58:14

Track 1: stuff on like TikTok, TikTok, you know, store and all this stuff.

Speaker: 00:58:18

Track 1: And like the movie today could still be made and like, and still have very valid

Speaker: 00:58:24

Track 1: criticism and like critique of corporate culture. but the difference is that

Speaker: 00:58:29

Track 1: people are buying less shit because like they can't afford to buy them.

Speaker: 00:58:32

Track 3: Yeah. And also you don't necessarily need to create a whole conspiracy to sell

Speaker: 00:58:35

Track 3: people shit because that's literally what we have TikTok influencers for. And like these,

Speaker: 00:58:41

Track 3: like the so-called like trad wives

Speaker: 00:58:44

Track 3: and the minimalist living and like all of that and it's really just

Speaker: 00:58:47

Track 3: more stuff to buy so that you can minimize the

Speaker: 00:58:50

Track 3: amount of crap taking up space in your house and like but even aside from the

Speaker: 00:58:57

Track 3: under tracks and like using that to sell stuff to people that's i mean they're

Speaker: 00:59:03

Track 3: literal songs that have been out forever about actual products like there's

Speaker: 00:59:08

Track 3: that the Red Solo Cup one,

Speaker: 00:59:10

Track 3: and then there's the Air Force Ones one.

Speaker: 00:59:15

Track 3: And it's just that over and over again.

Speaker: 00:59:16

Track 1: There's an Adidas one. Subliminal subtext to just like, buy this thing.

Speaker: 00:59:20

Track 3: Just saying brands. Yeah. There's like an Adidas one. I can't remember.

Speaker: 00:59:24

Track 3: I feel like I had a couple others.

Speaker: 00:59:26

Track 2: I mean, that's been a criticism against a lot of, you know, newer,

Speaker: 00:59:33

Track 2: you know, or contemporary rap from rap artists historically,

Speaker: 00:59:37

Track 2: you know, like who came up during like more radical time.

Speaker: 00:59:40

Track 2: Like that you've taken what was a radical and, you know, revolutionary in a

Speaker: 00:59:47

Track 2: lot of ways, culture and art and turned it into commercialized slop and you're pushing products.

Speaker: 00:59:53

Track 2: It's all you're doing. You were selling that, you know, especially the gangster

Speaker: 00:59:57

Track 2: rap that became, that started out as very, very, you know, like anti-establishment

Speaker: 01:00:04

Track 2: and then turned into, you know,

Speaker: 01:00:06

Track 2: Gucci and, you know, Cristal and, you know, bitches and hoes.

Speaker: 01:00:10

Track 2: And that's, that's what it became.

Speaker: 01:00:11

Track 3: Yeah. The whole shift after Tupac and Biggie over to like, okay,

Speaker: 01:00:15

Track 3: okay. So now you have Diddy and we all know what he was doing.

Speaker: 01:00:18

Track 2: It's on. Speaking of people, things, finding out things about people.

Speaker: 01:00:23

Track 3: He was involved. Yeah, and he was involved.

Speaker: 01:00:26

Track 1: Yeah, you think about Ice-T and some of those bands in the 80s actually singing

Speaker: 01:00:30

Track 1: about NWA of their conditions.

Speaker: 01:00:34

Track 1: They're talking about the material conditions and the way that they're being treated by police.

Speaker: 01:00:38

Track 2: And now we have Ice-T, who is literally just playing copaganda.

Speaker: 01:00:44

Track 3: Yeah.

Speaker: 01:00:45

Track 1: Oh, boy. And Ice Cube also playing. Wait, isn't he in like a—no,

Speaker: 01:00:50

Track 1: he's not in a cop show. He's just like in bad movies.

Speaker: 01:00:51

Track 3: No, he's not like, are you there yet or whatever. because like family movies

Speaker: 01:00:54

Track 3: now and so and war of the worlds yeah which is which is.

Speaker: 01:01:00

Track 2: Just one commercial for amazon.

Speaker: 01:01:02

Track 1: Yeah we we really truly have like come full circle.

Speaker: 01:01:07

Track 3: And i do want to talk about the whole not that we were even alluding to this

Speaker: 01:01:11

Track 3: but the whole pirating thing and the and the,

Speaker: 01:01:15

Track 3: surreptitiously sailing the seas to get stuff um how do you think that would

Speaker: 01:01:21

Track 3: factor in to like this reality of the putting subliminal stuff in music would it matter would they.

Speaker: 01:01:28

Track 2: Fucking care i don't think they care now that's

Speaker: 01:01:31

Track 2: the thing yeah i think they make a big deal about it but i don't think that

Speaker: 01:01:36

Track 2: it has never been the music industry despite all their shit they've never been

Speaker: 01:01:40

Track 2: the one's losing money on it any of this ever i mean for all of the fact that

Speaker: 01:01:46

Track 2: metallica are scumbags and hetford is a piece of shit like they.

Speaker: 01:01:51

Track 3: Beat the shit out of du jour too their fans did anyway.

Speaker: 01:01:54

Track 2: Oh my god oh my god god that's fucking perfect i totally forgot,

Speaker: 01:02:02

Track 2: for all the fact that like hetfield is a piece of

Speaker: 01:02:05

Track 2: shit like he is correct in that

Speaker: 01:02:08

Track 2: like they were the ones suffering not the industry

Speaker: 01:02:11

Track 2: not the not the recording companies they were the ones who were being you know

Speaker: 01:02:16

Track 2: being losing money just like now like all they did all all that happened is

Speaker: 01:02:22

Track 2: that the music industry co-opted piracy that's all spotify is yeah you took the.

Speaker: 01:02:30

Track 1: Words out of my mouth is like the the person who's now stealing from the artist

Speaker: 01:02:34

Track 1: is not people pirating music or pirating movies or pirating books or whatever

Speaker: 01:02:39

Track 1: it is it's the fact that spotify and these companies have all of the music and they.

Speaker: 01:02:45

Track 2: Give the.

Speaker: 01:02:45

Track 1: Artists almost nothing while they're profiting billions and.

Speaker: 01:02:48

Track 2: I mean it's always been music has always been a loss leader like the sale of

Speaker: 01:02:55

Track 2: music has was always a loss lead and like where a band makes money is on tours

Speaker: 01:03:02

Track 2: and merch not selling their music.

Speaker: 01:03:06

Track 3: So in i i've meant to bring this up um in 1995 tlc got on stage at the grammys,

Speaker: 01:03:13

Track 3: and they were like we're fucking broke they had

Speaker: 01:03:16

Track 3: all of them bankrupt they were making like 50 cents

Speaker: 01:03:19

Track 3: off of each album split three ways they were making no

Speaker: 01:03:22

Track 3: money because all that money was going to record execs

Speaker: 01:03:25

Track 3: and managers and everybody else but the people actually creating the stuff and

Speaker: 01:03:30

Track 3: this is why i get frustrated when people are like i think it was i think it

Speaker: 01:03:33

Track 3: was actually the thing that set me off and i probably ranted to you about the

Speaker: 01:03:36

Track 3: seven was somebody was talking about anthony bourdain they were like the rich

Speaker: 01:03:38

Track 3: includes you know well he he had money so i'm like first quality's dad shut

Speaker: 01:03:41

Track 3: up secondly secondly never.

Speaker: 01:03:43

Track 2: Besmirch anthony bourdain.

Speaker: 01:03:44

Track 3: No like shut your fucking mouth it's not about the amount of money yeah like

Speaker: 01:03:50

Track 3: any of these people aren't making a ton of money they don't even have control

Speaker: 01:03:54

Track 3: over their own fucking art like they're not controlling their own means of production

Speaker: 01:03:59

Track 3: even though they are the means of production like they're not,

Speaker: 01:04:02

Track 3: taylor swift the value of their work.

Speaker: 01:04:04

Track 2: Exception to this like taylor swift.

Speaker: 01:04:07

Track 3: Is the.

Speaker: 01:04:07

Track 2: Exception that proves the rule like.

Speaker: 01:04:08

Track 3: She is.

Speaker: 01:04:09

Track 2: Literally the like she's the thing you compare to like oh you know it's like

Speaker: 01:04:14

Track 2: because of what she has you know acquired and and contained.

Speaker: 01:04:18

Track 3: You know obtained but the vast majority was the norm nobody would be talking

Speaker: 01:04:21

Track 3: about it exactly nobody would be pointing to her and.

Speaker: 01:04:24

Track 1: The thing about anthony bourdain well sorry i was just saying about anthony

Speaker: 01:04:26

Track 1: bourdain like to to to because i love anthony bourdain.

Speaker: 01:04:29

Track 3: Yeah he.

Speaker: 01:04:30

Track 1: At the time like when he died about seven years ago i think like 2018.

Speaker: 01:04:33

Track 3: He like.

Speaker: 01:04:34

Track 1: You know you go online you're like so like celebrity's name,

Speaker: 01:04:38

Track 1: net worth, and it just like spits out some like article that just isn't, which is also bullshit.

Speaker: 01:04:42

Track 1: So like there are articles about him saying he was like had tens of millions

Speaker: 01:04:45

Track 1: of dollars, but he basically said like, I barely make any money.

Speaker: 01:04:48

Track 1: Like once I like pay my, for my apartment and like I don't have any stuff.

Speaker: 01:04:53

Track 1: Like he wasn't, the reason why he brought his show to CNN was because he was broke.

Speaker: 01:04:57

Track 3: Yeah, he was working constantly. He was flying all over the fucking planet.

Speaker: 01:05:01

Track 3: The dude, like, if he was rich, do you think he'd be going everywhere all the time?

Speaker: 01:05:04

Track 1: Yeah, the Food Network, the money he was making was essentially,

Speaker: 01:05:07

Track 1: like, just the way you look at a band like the Grateful Dead until,

Speaker: 01:05:10

Track 1: like, the 80s. They made no money.

Speaker: 01:05:12

Track 1: They were just, like, they're living off of what they had just to, anyway, sorry.

Speaker: 01:05:16

Track 2: Alan Cummings' character literally, like, says it right off,

Speaker: 01:05:20

Track 2: has them sign that contract and says,

Speaker: 01:05:23

Track 2: you know, like, you will get this, you know, like, I forget

Speaker: 01:05:26

Track 2: what he says exactly it's like we will take this we're like you'll be you'll

Speaker: 01:05:30

Track 2: get the money back do you know or like you'll make the money back or you'll

Speaker: 01:05:33

Track 2: pay it back don't worry about it and it's like hand waved away as i assume it

Speaker: 01:05:38

Track 2: is in real life you know where it's like oh no no it'll be fine it's exploitation.

Speaker: 01:05:43

Track 1: Of young artists who like want to.

Speaker: 01:05:45

Track 2: Make it big.

Speaker: 01:05:46

Track 1: They want to make an album and so they sign on the dotted line and they get

Speaker: 01:05:49

Track 1: fucked i mean you also see their manager who they mention She's like,

Speaker: 01:05:53

Track 1: oh, you're going to get 15%.

Speaker: 01:05:55

Track 1: And, like, it seemed pretty clear, like, throughout the rest of the movie, he didn't get anything.

Speaker: 01:05:58

Track 3: Well, he didn't do anything either.

Speaker: 01:06:00

Track 1: Well, true.

Speaker: 01:06:01

Track 3: To be clear.

Speaker: 01:06:02

Track 2: But really, the fact, the way he responds to him, though, really says everything.

Speaker: 01:06:08

Track 2: Like, let's not wave him off or, like, make him as, like, you know,

Speaker: 01:06:15

Track 2: innocent or, like, you know, like, not.

Speaker: 01:06:17

Track 2: Because he is very clearly throughout the movie, like,

Speaker: 01:06:23

Track 2: He has tickets to du jour. He buys tickets to du jour.

Speaker: 01:06:26

Track 2: He doesn't show up to their set. He's taking money from them.

Speaker: 01:06:30

Track 2: They don't make any money.

Speaker: 01:06:32

Track 2: Then he's like, oh, what do I get?

Speaker: 01:06:35

Track 2: And then later on, the way the music exec responds to him is in such a way of,

Speaker: 01:06:40

Track 2: it's very much class solidarity.

Speaker: 01:06:43

Track 2: It's like, oh, you're part of the exploitive class. You're part of my group.

Speaker: 01:06:47

Track 1: Yes.

Speaker: 01:06:48

Track 2: Yes. Yes. No, no, you'll be fine. And he's like, okay, yeah,

Speaker: 01:06:52

Track 2: good. But no concern for them, nothing, no questions asked, just,

Speaker: 01:06:56

Track 2: oh, I'm going to get something? Good enough.

Speaker: 01:06:58

Track 1: When they say they're going to split the $5 from that bowling alley gig,

Speaker: 01:07:02

Track 1: that, to me, feels like very much the TLC thing that you just said.

Speaker: 01:07:06

Track 3: Yeah.

Speaker: 01:07:06

Track 1: I feel like that's a one-to-one. They took that as their inspiration for that joke.

Speaker: 01:07:12

Track 2: Anyway, I'm just giving you that. It reminds me, what?

Speaker: 01:07:14

Track 1: No, go ahead. I wasn't saying anything.

Speaker: 01:07:16

Track 2: What did I miss?

Speaker: 01:07:17

Track 1: I was giving Ashley the, like, you brought that up.

Speaker: 01:07:21

Track 2: Oh yeah this is

Speaker: 01:07:25

Track 2: not we don't have to keep this in but it's just very

Speaker: 01:07:27

Track 2: much so like my favorite band just

Speaker: 01:07:31

Track 2: retired and they never had huge

Speaker: 01:07:34

Track 2: commercial success and they just spent 25 years

Speaker: 01:07:39

Track 2: touring and never and then

Speaker: 01:07:41

Track 2: finally like they're all in their like 40s and they're just

Speaker: 01:07:44

Track 2: like we can't do it anymore like we

Speaker: 01:07:47

Track 2: just can't we've never you know been able

Speaker: 01:07:50

Track 2: we've never cleared more than like 30 or

Speaker: 01:07:53

Track 2: 40 grand a year like we've spent

Speaker: 01:07:56

Track 2: all of our lives touring never making

Speaker: 01:08:00

Track 2: enough money and it's like they're like we can't do it anymore you know it's

Speaker: 01:08:05

Track 2: like that's what it is that's what and then meanwhile you have people like taylor

Speaker: 01:08:11

Track 2: swift who got i could talk about how much i hate her for fucking hours um you.

Speaker: 01:08:17

Track 3: Get a lot of comments.

Speaker: 01:08:18

Track 2: Bring it bring him.

Speaker: 01:08:23

Track 1: To like getting to the like the end of the movie

Speaker: 01:08:26

Track 1: is also like ridiculous in the in like just

Speaker: 01:08:29

Track 1: the way that they have to sort of so weird sum things

Speaker: 01:08:32

Track 1: up and like primarily like the it's very much in

Speaker: 01:08:34

Track 1: the the like zoolander kind of ending where

Speaker: 01:08:37

Track 1: there's just sort of like a big showdown and like everyone sort of admits their

Speaker: 01:08:41

Track 1: thing you know that fiona played by parker posey is like she has a lisp and

Speaker: 01:08:45

Track 1: she's like is sort of the whole point of that concert was to like make people

Speaker: 01:08:49

Track 1: like her because she's also insecure about her own you know lisp and her like

Speaker: 01:08:53

Track 1: teeth and then we just find that

Speaker: 01:08:55

Track 1: alan coming is was like they knew each other and they sort of you know this

Speaker: 01:08:59

Track 1: heartfelt moment like you know after they go to jail they can maybe be together

Speaker: 01:09:03

Track 1: you know kind of thing and it's it's like such a ridiculous ending that i'm

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Track 1: just like sure okay you know like,

Speaker: 01:09:16

Track 1: yeah it's like it's it's like a lot of these movies of this kind of thing It's

Speaker: 01:09:20

Track 1: sort of like the ending is sort of, you know, the conspiracy or like the thing

Speaker: 01:09:24

Track 1: that comes out and then they sort of have that concert at the end to sort of,

Speaker: 01:09:27

Track 1: you know, to end everything.

Speaker: 01:09:30

Track 3: And yeah, I do think that Fiona's whole deal of just wanting everybody to think she's cool.

Speaker: 01:09:36

Track 3: Her like very deep seated insecurity is just what I imagine is like running

Speaker: 01:09:41

Track 3: through the mind on a deeper level of like every tech CEO.

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Track 2: A hundred percent.

Speaker: 01:09:47

Track 3: Like that complete self-hatred and never feeling good enough is the driving force behind me.

Speaker: 01:09:53

Track 3: Like an Elon Musk, for example, or like a Mark Zuckerberg.

Speaker: 01:09:56

Track 2: Are we going to bring up our favorite term lately? Alienation?

Speaker: 01:10:02

Track 2: How all these people are victims of capital, even as they push it.

Speaker: 01:10:07

Track 2: And they're alienated from themselves and their community. And that's why they do these things.

Speaker: 01:10:12

Track 3: They're the child who was not embraced by the village. So they're burning it down.

Speaker: 01:10:18

Track 2: They're going to burn it down.

Speaker: 01:10:18

Track 3: Yeah, everybody's 12.

Speaker: 01:10:19

Track 2: Everybody's 12.

Speaker: 01:10:20

Track 1: Those are like the two most popular theories on this podcast is alien asian

Speaker: 01:10:25

Track 1: and everybody's 12 and uh it's.

Speaker: 01:10:27

Track 3: So true though.

Speaker: 01:10:28

Track 1: It really is just it's i mean it does explain that she has she creates this

Speaker: 01:10:35

Track 1: entire elaborate plot you know to get rich perhaps but also if no one likes

Speaker: 01:10:41

Track 1: me what's the point of all of this i have 500 billion dollars but like people

Speaker: 01:10:45

Track 1: won't praise me on the internet.

Speaker: 01:10:47

Track 1: Oh, I'm sad. I made this truck that no one likes. Why?

Speaker: 01:10:52

Track 1: Well, I'm going to make everyone's life miserable and make the most disgusting.

Speaker: 01:10:55

Track 3: I'm going to make a robot that makes fucking...

Speaker: 01:10:59

Track 3: child abuse materials and and tells everybody i'm cool and that i could piss

Speaker: 01:11:04

Track 3: further than anybody else even than the person who has the world.

Speaker: 01:11:07

Track 1: And also has brockipedia because like you know wikipedia is too woke like yeah

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Track 1: i mean it i it's very yeah it's very

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Track 1: coded into this you know deep-seated insecurity of like the ceo tech ceo i.

Speaker: 01:11:21

Track 2: I don't love that they attempted to basically give them like redeem them in

Speaker: 01:11:28

Track 2: some way like i don't love that.

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Track 1: Yeah well.

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Track 3: They kind of address it right away they're like in a in a creepy ironic way

Speaker: 01:11:34

Track 3: like i guess it's cute or whatever like yeah which is what josie says like immediately

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Track 3: yeah melody says it's romantic but that's because she's she's all heart and nothing else a.

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Track 2: Bag of hammers.

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Track 3: Nothing's going on up here but she's right here this and for those listening

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Track 3: at home i'm indicating your heart um.

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Track 1: That's where that's where melody's head lies

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Track 1: so one of my other also i think one of the other i

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Track 1: think one of my favorite comedic scenes is when

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Track 1: the uh the the like government guy

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Track 1: i don't know what his title is like a agent something agent kelly i think he

Speaker: 01:12:08

Track 1: is like leaving and parker posey keeps like continuing sentences and she's like

Speaker: 01:12:12

Track 1: what did you just say and that is like it's it's funny because like after the

Speaker: 01:12:18

Track 1: first time you're like haha that's pretty funny and then they like do it again.

Speaker: 01:12:21

Track 1: And like, then it's even funnier. It's just, it's.

Speaker: 01:12:23

Track 2: They did the three, they did the three times. Also, what the fuck was up with

Speaker: 01:12:28

Track 2: that outfit she was wearing? That was like cat toys.

Speaker: 01:12:30

Track 3: Looked like negative patches too? No, the other one.

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Track 2: The cat toys.

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Track 3: Yeah.

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Track 1: See, to me that looked like she had like, uh, what's the, uh,

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Track 1: acupuncture needles like sticking out of her shirt.

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Track 3: Oh yeah.

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Track 2: It reminded me of cat toys with the long, the long stick and the feathers. Yeah. Cat dancer.

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Track 3: Yeah.

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Track 2: Yeah.

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Track 3: Yeah.

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Track 2: That's what it reminded me of. It was fucking wild.

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Track 3: Yes.

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Track 2: Yeah, I can tell you. I know you can tell. You clearly know cats.

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Track 1: They also threw in for just because, you know, it's had to do it is when they

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Track 1: go, when they all go to see her at her party and she has like all the product

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Track 1: food on the thing. And she's like, I'm going to have a big snack.

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Track 1: And then she puts like a single Pringle on there too.

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Track 1: So they have to also throw in the sort of female body image in there too.

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Track 2: Which we talked my wife and i talked about

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Track 2: a lot because the clothing in this

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Track 2: like despite everything like this

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Track 2: movie is still was still very much a victim of the time and the imagery it was

Speaker: 01:13:28

Track 2: pushing it's like oh yeah it's gonna make this comment but every one of these

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Track 2: characters is gonna wear clothing that only fits one body type and it's like

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Track 2: and it's gonna present it like, oh, these are heroes.

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Track 2: Look how beautiful they are. And it's like that early 2000s that,

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Track 2: like, first of all, the low rise pants that, like, you know,

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Track 2: Jesus Christ, so low rise.

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Track 2: And then the, like, you know, the shirt, the open back shirt.

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Track 2: And it's like only one body type can wear that. That's it.

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Track 2: If, you know, anybody else tries to, you know, any other young woman tries to

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Track 2: wear a clothes, like, you know, shirt like that.

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Track 3: It's going to be the joke. Yeah. If they're putting them in that for the movie,

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Track 3: it's because it's a joke.

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Track 2: Yeah. It's just like, but in this, it's like, you know, they're in it and it's

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Track 2: like, well, they fit that standard perfectly.

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Track 2: That's what they are, the body type of that, that they're pushing, you know?

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Track 2: And it's like, it's still inevitable because it is part of the system that it

Speaker: 01:14:32

Track 2: is still pushing some of this because this is not as satirical as it is.

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Track 2: The people behind this are still beholden to some of these things.

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Track 2: They are not radical people.

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Track 2: at a level of truly breaking away from a system and they are still reinforcing quite a lot of bad shit.

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Track 3: Well yeah and i think that's i in a weird way i think that kind of it kind of

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Track 3: supports the whole central conceit of the film which is that you know any artist

Speaker: 01:15:07

Track 3: you like capitalism makes hucksters and and fucking used car salesmen of artists you know

Speaker: 01:15:16

Track 3: the only way they can survive and when you

Speaker: 01:15:19

Track 3: make a movie like this or any movie like remember when

Speaker: 01:15:22

Track 3: we did the menu it's like regardless of what the message is there's always over

Speaker: 01:15:29

Track 3: here the fact that it's being produced for a profit by people who have certain

Speaker: 01:15:34

Track 3: metrics to me and there are limits to what they're allowed to say and what they're

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Track 3: allowed to do and there's also expectations that they're supposed to live up to,

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Track 3: which is also an aesthetic because you're right.

Speaker: 01:15:44

Track 3: In 2001, in low-rise jeans, they're not putting...

Speaker: 01:15:50

Track 3: any fat people in this movie it's just not happening you

Speaker: 01:15:53

Track 3: know it's just that and that's exactly the same

Speaker: 01:15:56

Track 3: thing that happens with josie and valerie

Speaker: 01:16:00

Track 3: and melody it's like for the best of their intentions their their music as as

Speaker: 01:16:06

Track 3: authentic as it is and how and however much it is true to who they are and what

Speaker: 01:16:10

Track 3: they want to make it still is used to sell something until they take the

Speaker: 01:16:18

Track 3: conspiracy and the company right out of it.

Speaker: 01:16:20

Track 3: I don't know how they got to still do the concert. Nobody knows.

Speaker: 01:16:25

Track 2: The mystery is there, just like how is Alan M. miked up?

Speaker: 01:16:28

Track 3: Nobody knows. It's okay. Don't worry about it. But at that point, it's pure.

Speaker: 01:16:35

Track 2: Listen, the venue was paid for already.

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Track 3: Yeah, and everybody's already there.

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Track 2: They're already there.

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Track 3: What are you going to do?

Speaker: 01:16:41

Track 1: I like, too, how they had the car there that they were going to use to have

Speaker: 01:16:46

Track 1: be blown up like in the parking lot too and it's like on the on the like showroom

Speaker: 01:16:51

Track 1: car spinny thing it's like,

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Track 1: why not yeah well the u.s.

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Track 3: Government's paying for it and that's the fact that they didn't know that the

Speaker: 01:17:00

Track 3: message that she was putting out was that she was cool and everybody should

Speaker: 01:17:03

Track 3: want to hang out with fiona or date her it's because it's.

Speaker: 01:17:06

Track 1: Because they sent samples to the government but we already had that in the subliminal

Speaker: 01:17:11

Track 1: messages so the government was subliminally convinced to do it despite.

Speaker: 01:17:16

Track 3: Or because the government literally just

Speaker: 01:17:19

Track 3: the u.s government just fucking gives money to the military and any other seedy

Speaker: 01:17:25

Track 3: operation without really fucking caring how it's going as long as they see results

Speaker: 01:17:30

Track 3: they don't really nobody's really paying attention how much money did the pentagon

Speaker: 01:17:33

Track 3: just lose nobody fucking we will never know who cares we'll never know.

Speaker: 01:17:38

Track 2: I do think it's important that we do, for those who did not watch the movie,

Speaker: 01:17:43

Track 2: it is important to point out that DuJour did survive and show up at the end

Speaker: 01:17:48

Track 2: of the movie and expose everything in full body casts, including Dr.

Speaker: 01:17:54

Track 2: Zayas in a full body cast attached to his owner's full body cast.

Speaker: 01:18:06

Track 1: I love a full body cast bit it's it's kind of hard to to beat one of those like

Speaker: 01:18:11

Track 1: also it feels like very of that time too and.

Speaker: 01:18:13

Track 2: Seth green i think it was seth green seth green's full body cast had the flames

Speaker: 01:18:18

Track 2: of his his jacket drawn on the full body cast.

Speaker: 01:18:22

Track 1: Yeah yeah that's right yeah

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Track 1: they definitely had a very good attention to these like little silly

Speaker: 01:18:29

Track 1: details and uh i also love just like

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Track 1: the command center underground of this record label of

Speaker: 01:18:35

Track 1: like they're you know they have like the tv and then

Speaker: 01:18:38

Track 1: all these different things and i mean you could also call a lot of this too

Speaker: 01:18:43

Track 1: is sort of the usurping of mtv from being like the place in the 80s and early

Speaker: 01:18:48

Track 1: 90s that just had cool music videos to being a trash show a trash channel that

Speaker: 01:18:54

Track 1: just did not do that anymore uh so trash.

Speaker: 01:18:58

Track 2: Channel with trash shows that gave us eventually i believe our deputy fbi director

Speaker: 01:19:04

Track 2: yeah our deputy fbi director i believe was on road rules.

Speaker: 01:19:08

Track 1: Oh i did not know that but that of course he did it's the stupidest fucking.

Speaker: 01:19:15

Track 3: Timeline i can't i can't fuck every day i learn something else that's so fucking

Speaker: 01:19:20

Track 3: stupid that i'm like what what is this wake me up from the coma what's happening no.

Speaker: 01:19:27

Track 2: I'm sorry it's not him but it is somebody else it's some other fucking fed.

Speaker: 01:19:32

Track 3: If any of those people are involved in government i just want to say,

Speaker: 01:19:36

Track 3: This is the stupidest. It's just, it's so, it's so fucking dumb.

Speaker: 01:19:39

Track 1: I thought you were going to tell me that like Serena Altschul,

Speaker: 01:19:42

Track 1: who I think is one of the, he's in the movie as herself on MTV News,

Speaker: 01:19:45

Track 1: who like does the report as of them dying in the like blaze of crash.

Speaker: 01:19:50

Track 1: I thought you were going to tell me like that she was working for the,

Speaker: 01:19:53

Track 1: you know, U.S. government.

Speaker: 01:19:54

Track 3: Well, the secretary of education was married to Vince McMahon.

Speaker: 01:19:58

Track 3: Like that's a real fucking thing. Like it's all so stupid. It's reality TV show bullshit.

Speaker: 01:20:03

Track 2: I have got to find who it was.

Speaker: 01:20:07

Track 1: Kurt Loder is 80 years old.

Speaker: 01:20:09

Track 2: Jesus Christ. Thank you.

Speaker: 01:20:10

Track 1: That's wild.

Speaker: 01:20:11

Track 2: Thank you for making me feel old. Thank you.

Speaker: 01:20:13

Track 1: But that's just crazy. I mean, I guess we didn't think of him as being that

Speaker: 01:20:18

Track 1: old when he was on the show for some reason. But anyway.

Speaker: 01:20:23

Track 3: Oh, did you catch at the beginning when they're in the cafe or whatever?

Speaker: 01:20:27

Track 3: Oh, sorry. At the fucking Starbucks. and he's like oh it's so happy to be sitting

Speaker: 01:20:33

Track 3: here with the pussy hats i wrote that down because that made me that made me laugh yeah i i didn't.

Speaker: 01:20:39

Track 1: At first get that in my brain and then.

Speaker: 01:20:41

Track 3: Like oh.

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Track 1: Yeah that's the.

Speaker: 01:20:42

Track 3: Haha the pussy hats go to brunch after this no.

Speaker: 01:20:45

Track 1: They would just go to starbucks because they're already there.

Speaker: 01:20:47

Track 3: They're already there yeah it's.

Speaker: 01:20:49

Track 2: Sean duffy he was previously on the real world.

Speaker: 01:20:53

Track 3: What does he do what's his deal i can't be bothered he.

Speaker: 01:20:56

Track 2: Is the secretary of transportation.

Speaker: 01:20:57

Track 3: Right okay yeah,

Speaker: 01:21:00

Track 3: I mean, did you say it was on World Rules, though?

Speaker: 01:21:03

Track 2: Yeah, but it was the real world.

Speaker: 01:21:05

Track 3: But that's really funny because transportation, that's actually hilarious.

Speaker: 01:21:10

Track 2: That's my experience. Jackie actually texted me.

Speaker: 01:21:14

Track 2: Jackie heard and texted me. She just poked her head. She's like,

Speaker: 01:21:19

Track 2: I texted you who you're thinking of.

Speaker: 01:21:23

Track 2: um he um was

Speaker: 01:21:26

Track 2: really good uh representative for wisconsin's

Speaker: 01:21:30

Track 2: seventh congressional congressional district um district uh attorney of ashland

Speaker: 01:21:34

Track 2: county and he is the current secretary of transportation um who is we have a

Speaker: 01:21:40

Track 2: pretty fucking terrible comments and pretty terrible things A long.

Speaker: 01:21:47

Track 3: Strange trip it's been.

Speaker: 01:21:48

Track 1: We, we, we, we.

Speaker: 01:21:51

Track 2: He was also on Road Rules. He was also on Road Rules. He was on Road Rules All Stars.

Speaker: 01:21:57

Track 3: Wow.

Speaker: 01:21:59

Track 1: Well, that's the top.

Speaker: 01:22:00

Track 2: So, yes, that's how he has his expertise. Yeah, that's how he's. That's why he's.

Speaker: 01:22:05

Track 1: I saw things with wheels and I'm like, I'm going to do that.

Speaker: 01:22:10

Track 3: Yeah.

Speaker: 01:22:11

Track 1: We're not going to do any trains because those would actually. I know the road.

Speaker: 01:22:15

Track 3: Yeah.

Speaker: 01:22:15

Track 1: He was going to use roads. The roads rule. How many times do you think he's like said that at stuff?

Speaker: 01:22:22

Track 2: This is the fucking country we live in. Yeah.

Speaker: 01:22:25

Track 3: So stupid.

Speaker: 01:22:26

Track 2: Fuck. He lives in New Jersey now. God damn it. Fuck.

Speaker: 01:22:30

Track 3: Where in New Jersey?

Speaker: 01:22:32

Track 2: Far Hills.

Speaker: 01:22:35

Track 1: Any last things on Josie and the Pussycat?

Speaker: 01:22:39

Track 3: I don't know. I don't think so. um but i'm so glad i'm so glad you guys watched

Speaker: 01:22:44

Track 3: this and i'm glad you had a good time with it um.

Speaker: 01:22:47

Track 1: It is a movie that people should watch, you know? I mean.

Speaker: 01:22:53

Track 2: I think, like you said earlier, Ashley, that this has become kind of like a

Speaker: 01:22:59

Track 2: topic in the zeitgeist lately.

Speaker: 01:23:01

Track 2: I think it's because this movie accurately predicted exactly where we are. Yeah.

Speaker: 01:23:07

Track 3: It was pretty fucking, I mean, speaking of The Simpsons.

Speaker: 01:23:11

Track 2: Yeah.

Speaker: 01:23:11

Track 3: It did. It did predict a lot.

Speaker: 01:23:13

Track 2: This is pretty spot on for where we are as a culture, you know,

Speaker: 01:23:21

Track 2: minus subliminal message, because as Evan has already put out, we don't need them.

Speaker: 01:23:25

Track 3: Yeah, they're just saying stuff now.

Speaker: 01:23:27

Track 2: They just say it.

Speaker: 01:23:28

Track 3: Yeah. It's like, no, we kidnapped him. Yeah. We took him.

Speaker: 01:23:33

Track 2: Yeah, yeah.

Speaker: 01:23:34

Track 3: He's here now. We took him.

Speaker: 01:23:35

Track 1: We're going to get oil and stuff. Good, you know, satire and over the top.

Speaker: 01:23:40

Track 1: And, you know, I mean, from that era of like early 2000s, late 90s,

Speaker: 01:23:46

Track 1: I mean, it really deserved better is all I would say. Deserved better.

Speaker: 01:23:52

Track 2: It was ahead of its time.

Speaker: 01:23:54

Track 3: It deserves a prime spot on pre-9-11 film.

Speaker: 01:23:58

Track 1: Film one of these days one of these days i am gonna do some kind of i think

Speaker: 01:24:05

Track 1: i've been saying it's like three years like a pre post 9 11 type of it comes

Speaker: 01:24:10

Track 1: up in movies that are around that period anyway but just i'm sure there's a

Speaker: 01:24:15

Track 1: lot more that could be people.

Speaker: 01:24:16

Track 3: Were feeling confident they were feeling like i can say some stuff about the government.

Speaker: 01:24:20

Track 1: You know i mean i think you're 100 % correct, though.

Speaker: 01:24:24

Track 1: Like, five months later, this movie probably doesn't come out,

Speaker: 01:24:28

Track 1: or they may come change stuff.

Speaker: 01:24:29

Track 2: We'd talk about it in a very different way. We'd be talking about it in a Red Dawn sort of way.

Speaker: 01:24:33

Track 1: Duh.

Speaker: 01:24:33

Track 3: Oh, God. Yeah.

Speaker: 01:24:38

Track 1: Not good.

Speaker: 01:24:38

Track 2: We're Marxists, man. We can talk about anything in any way. We can always find

Speaker: 01:24:43

Track 2: a thing to pick apart. Yeah.

Speaker: 01:24:45

Track 1: Just might not be the most pleasant experience.

Speaker: 01:24:48

Track 2: Yeah, yeah.

Speaker: 01:24:49

Track 1: This, on the other hand, very, very positive experience.

Speaker: 01:24:52

Track 2: Yeah, I gotta be honest. I'd rather watch this at Old Boy.

Speaker: 01:24:57

Track 1: I mean, that's like, those are such polar opposite films that, sure.

Speaker: 01:25:04

Track 2: I'd rather watch this than The Long Walk, which I'm going to have to watch again.

Speaker: 01:25:08

Track 2: Sneak peek, folks. We're going to do The Long Walk soon. And boy,

Speaker: 01:25:12

Track 2: am I not looking forward to watching that again.

Speaker: 01:25:14

Track 3: Good luck. That's going to be a long walk. How long is that movie?

Speaker: 01:25:17

Track 2: I don't remember. It's not short.

Speaker: 01:25:19

Track 3: Okay.

Speaker: 01:25:20

Track 1: It feels like four. Like a long walk.

Speaker: 01:25:24

Track 3: That's what I've heard.

Speaker: 01:25:26

Track 1: It's very good. Ashley, thank you for making us watch this film.

Speaker: 01:25:30

Track 1: It was a pleasure as always to have you on.

Speaker: 01:25:33

Track 3: Thank you so much. Such a fun time as always.

Speaker: 01:25:38

Track 1: Amazing.

Speaker: 01:25:38

Track 2: Well, thank you for joining us.

Speaker: 01:25:40

Track 1: You can listen subscribe to the podcast stuff on all the podcast places and

Speaker: 01:25:47

Track 1: i'll catch you next week with bill only see.

Speaker: 01:25:50

Track 2: You next week.