Episode 249
Gareth Edwards Films: Rogue One (2016)
Rogue One is a Star Wars story, but really it's a Jyn and Andor story.
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Track 3: Just like I complained in Andor whenever the Force healer was like 10 seconds
Speaker:Track 3: out of all of the entirety of Andor. And I was like, this shit sucks.
Speaker:Track 3: This is the worst episode of the series so far. Yeah, no, that's how I feel
Speaker:Track 3: anytime the Force is involved. I just don't like the Force.
Speaker:Track 2: I actually have a cut of season two where they just remove her character from the show.
Speaker:Track 3: It's called the perfect cut.
Speaker:Track 2: I actually just someone on on threads sent me a cut that's i'm sure you could
Speaker:Track 2: find it on like a torrent somewhere but someone posted it on their google drive
Speaker:Track 2: and it's basically a cut that,
Speaker:Track 2: intertwines parts of andor with rogue one i didn't watch it but i it seemed cool i'm sure that.
Speaker:Track 3: I mean that's what was kind of talked about already was supposedly with a uh
Speaker:Track 3: re-release re like another a re-release theatrically of Rogue One with some snips of Andor.
Speaker:Track 3: I mean, for my re-watch of this, I watched the last three episodes of Andor
Speaker:Track 3: Season 2 and then Rogue One.
Speaker:Track 2: I realize I didn't send you the little document, but there's no notes on it,
Speaker:Track 2: just literally a little...
Speaker:Track 2: The notes for this movie are in my head.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah, the notes for the movie that we've all watched, like, fucking several times.
Speaker:Track 2: This is the third time I've seen it this year. I think it's now the movie I've watched the most.
Speaker:Track 3: You watch it monthly.
Speaker:Track 1: There was that one.
Speaker:Track 3: Like, you watched it.
Speaker:Track 1: Like, you watched it within two days the one time.
Speaker:Track 2: Yes, so I, yes, I watched it, and then I think it was, I had done a re- Oh.
Speaker:Track 1: Is that what your daughter wanted?
Speaker:Track 2: No, I re-watched Andor, I think, then. And then I watched it.
Speaker:Track 2: And then two nights later, she's like, oh, you watched it without me.
Speaker:Track 2: I'm like, all right, fine, I'll watch it again.
Speaker:Track 2: March 14th, 2025, or May 14th, and then May 16th, according to my letterbox.
Speaker:Track 4: Sit back in your seats, get something to eat, and watch this movie.
Speaker:Track 4: Don't let the kids see it, because we'll let you hear the video. Thank you.
Speaker:Track 2: Hello and welcome to Left of the Projector. I'm your host, Evan,
Speaker:Track 2: back again with another film discussion from the left.
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Speaker:Track 2: of our weekly episodes that drop every Tuesday. And now on to the show.
Speaker:Track 2: This week on Left of the Projector, we continue our series on Gareth Edwards with The Big One.
Speaker:Track 2: Being recorded on so-called Star Wars Day, we're talking about Rogue One,
Speaker:Track 2: also known as Season 3 of Andor.
Speaker:Track 2: Released in 2016, this was a monster box office hit.
Speaker:Track 2: With over $1 million in box office receipts, the film depicts the events prior
Speaker:Track 2: to Episode 4, A New Hope, where Cassian Andor and Jyn Erso, collectively with
Speaker:Track 2: their rebel companions, steal the plans for the Death Star.
Speaker:Track 2: Though it has to be noted that Tony Gilroy, the mastermind of Andor,
Speaker:Track 2: was hired to redirect reshoots, and there's been some stories back and forth
Speaker:Track 2: as to how much he was involved, but it does seem like there wasn't, uh,
Speaker:Track 2: he didn't take over the film, it was simply some rewrites.
Speaker:Track 2: But there's no Jedi, there's no Force, there's no Senate, none of that here,
Speaker:Track 2: just K2SO, Jyn, Saw Gerrera, and many of the characters we see in Andor.
Speaker:Track 2: But then today I have Ward and Bill.
Speaker:Track 3: No, there is Force in this movie.
Speaker:Track 1: That's a problem.
Speaker:Track 3: What are you talking about? That's a problem, if you ask me.
Speaker:Track 1: Wait, do you think he's not using the Force?
Speaker:Track 2: He has to be. He's blind.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah, I know.
Speaker:Track 1: You're the one who said there was no force.
Speaker:Track 2: I know. I realized that when I was writing that, I was thinking in my head that
Speaker:Track 2: this was like the Andor kind of thing.
Speaker:Track 2: I mean, there isn't any force in Andor. I know that there is the thing with
Speaker:Track 2: the woman, the healer, but she doesn't specifically call out what she's doing directly.
Speaker:Track 3: I mean, she's a force healer and she heals his shoulder after the laser blast.
Speaker:Track 3: But yeah. It's like barely anything, but it still makes the worst episode of Andor.
Speaker:Track 2: I know that there is the Force, and the character literally says,
Speaker:Track 2: I am the Force, or I'm one with the Force, the Force is with me, over and over again.
Speaker:Track 2: But it's not their mission, I don't believe, is dependent upon that.
Speaker:Track 1: There's no Jedi.
Speaker:Track 3: No, but a lot of the feats are. Yeah. A lot of the feats are Force-dependent.
Speaker:Track 2: I suppose. I suppose.
Speaker:Track 3: Which brings me to one of my complaints is Melshi gets, Melshi dies off screen.
Speaker:Track 3: Melshi, who escapes from Narkeena 5, dies off screen in this movie, but, uh...
Speaker:Track 3: Jedi apprentice Ip Man, Donnie Yen's character, Chira fucking gets to dodge and weave laser blasts.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah. I mean, I think that it only happens this way because this came before Andor. Exactly.
Speaker:Track 2: Like if Tony Gilroy had written Andor and then they released the movie that
Speaker:Track 2: fits in between, Mel, she would have been probably in it more.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah, that's the only reason.
Speaker:Track 3: Oh, I know it's the only reason. I'm still going to bitch about it because...
Speaker:Track 3: because i'm fucking miserable but no and
Speaker:Track 3: also because dude fucking this movie is like made better whenever you watch
Speaker:Track 3: andor like yes it preceded andor but everything's made better but that does
Speaker:Track 3: put a sour taste in my mouth like now after andor it's like the only thing that's
Speaker:Track 3: gotten worse is like wait he dies off screen now oh fuck yeah it.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah it sucks it's it's
Speaker:Track 2: kind of wild to me that i think about this is so they released you
Speaker:Track 2: know obviously the original trilogies episodes four through six then
Speaker:Track 2: they did the prequel trilogy and then they released this the
Speaker:Track 2: jj abrams force awakens and then between
Speaker:Track 2: that and the last jedi they released this movie rogue
Speaker:Track 2: one which it's almost hard to believe that there was then a star wars movie
Speaker:Track 2: almost every year i think every year for five years because they had force awakens
Speaker:Track 2: and uh rogue one last jedi the solo movie and then rise of skywalker they're
Speaker:Track 2: just blasting out star wars and there's been none of them since then until now yeah.
Speaker:Track 3: That was a crazy run true yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: Right didn't solo come out in between the two i hope that it did yeah.
Speaker:Track 3: I think it did.
Speaker:Track 2: Oh yeah 2018 it did yeah between the two pretty.
Speaker:Track 3: Sure it did yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: And that's like the biggest that's the biggest flop of the star wars era rogue one was not a flop,
Speaker:Track 2: Not a flop. But yeah, for people who are listening, you could and you should
Speaker:Track 2: listen to our seven-part series on Andor seasons one and two.
Speaker:Track 2: And that would be a perfect prequel to then listening to this one.
Speaker:Track 2: So you could, in theory, pause this episode, go back, listen to eight or nine
Speaker:Track 2: hours of Andor content, and then you could come back and listen to this.
Speaker:Track 2: If you want to be a completionist.
Speaker:Track 1: Eight or nine hours of Andor is, frankly, less Andor than you actually. You need more.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah, you'd be surprised how much Andor you actually need.
Speaker:Track 2: Actually, I think what would make more sense, actually, is for you to go back
Speaker:Track 2: and watch all of Andor, then listen to all of our discussion of Andor,
Speaker:Track 2: then watch Rogue One, and then listen to our discussion of Rogue One.
Speaker:Track 2: That's about 16 hours, give or take, of made-up number I just threw out there.
Speaker:Track 1: Is that actually a number you know?
Speaker:Track 2: I have no idea.
Speaker:Track 3: I think that's a low ball, actually.
Speaker:Track 2: I mean, eight or nine hours of us talking about it. It's got to be about eight
Speaker:Track 2: or nine hours of the show. No, more.
Speaker:Track 3: I mean, there's two seasons. Yeah, two seasons.
Speaker:Track 2: And the only reason we don't have an episode on every single episode of Andor
Speaker:Track 2: is that we have other parts of our lives.
Speaker:Track 3: And we also figured we'd spare you, the audience at home. Add some variety to the show.
Speaker:Track 2: Is there actually like an Andor rewatch podcast?
Speaker:Track 1: I thought you said there was one that you found.
Speaker:Track 2: Did I? Let's see. There's one
Speaker:Track 2: called Children of the Watch, which is like one of those ones, I think.
Speaker:Track 2: But I don't think that's, that's not about Andor actually directly.
Speaker:Track 1: Oh, I didn't see.
Speaker:Track 2: Andor rewatch episode. Yeah, it looks like there is one called The Children
Speaker:Track 2: of the Watch, a Star Wars after show. And it looks like they did one after each episode.
Speaker:Track 2: Seems like. But it's not from a leftist perspective, which is probably a bunch of Star Wars nerds.
Speaker:Track 1: There's also a tribe of two a podcast for andor i.
Speaker:Track 2: Think um i think uh proles did a,
Speaker:Track 2: episode on Andor. Not one about every episode. I think they just did one episode discussing it.
Speaker:Track 1: For one way in which they are weak in comparison to us.
Speaker:Track 2: What's that?
Speaker:Track 1: I said the one way they are weak in comparison to us.
Speaker:Track 2: In their Andor conversations?
Speaker:Track 1: Yes.
Speaker:Track 2: Let's see.
Speaker:Track 3: They can easily do 28 hours of Stalin, but only an hour for Andor.
Speaker:Track 1: Let me try.
Speaker:Track 3: We easily did how many hours of Andor? Yeah.
Speaker:Track 1: Come on, guys. How do we feel about this specific, you know,
Speaker:Track 1: and or specifically in the Gareth Edwards ouvreau? That's a ridiculous word.
Speaker:Track 2: You mean Rogue One?
Speaker:Track 1: There needs to be, yes, I'm sorry. There needs to be another word for that. Body of work.
Speaker:Track 1: That's three words. There needs to be a non-French word for that.
Speaker:Track 2: I mean, like amongst his films, like how do I rate it?
Speaker:Track 1: You know, we've, you know, we've, uh, you know, we've done, you know,
Speaker:Track 1: we've, we've got through so far. Monsters, Godzilla, never Rogue One.
Speaker:Track 2: It's definitely the best of the three movies, in my opinion, so far.
Speaker:Track 2: Of his, between those three movies, Rogue One is my favorite by far.
Speaker:Track 2: I mean, I've seen Rogue One, like, more than seven times.
Speaker:Track 2: Agreed. So, the difference is, though, Monsters was, like, his own thing.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: Godzilla is a franchise. Rogue One is a franchise. Part of a franchise.
Speaker:Track 2: the creator not part of a franchise Jurassic World part of a franchise so it's
Speaker:Track 2: interesting to see his he's done a lot of franchise work,
Speaker:Track 2: it's true I think it's I mean it's just a good movie you know forgetting that
Speaker:Track 2: it's Star Wars you know you can separate it from the rest of the franchise and
Speaker:Track 2: be like this is just I think a good movie.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah, if it wasn't, like, about the Death Star, then, like, you could easily
Speaker:Track 3: be like, oh, this is a dope sci-fi movie. Okay.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah, this movie doesn't have any, you don't need to know, you barely need to
Speaker:Track 1: know Star Wars to, like, to watch this image.
Speaker:Track 3: It's fantastic.
Speaker:Track 2: Do you think it would have been cool, though, if they made,
Speaker:Track 2: I don't think they'd ever do this, but if they made a star
Speaker:Track 2: wars movie that's in the universe that's
Speaker:Track 2: canon but it's like its own separate thing with
Speaker:Track 2: with mostly like different characters you know what i mean like just
Speaker:Track 2: kind of a someone just creates sort of a side movie
Speaker:Track 2: you know we're like none of this it's in the same world like the job
Speaker:Track 2: of the huts could exist you know the crime syndicate or
Speaker:Track 2: whatever but it's its own thing kind of like how uh like how they made the game
Speaker:Track 2: of the drones prequel show same universe but it's just like some other time
Speaker:Track 2: period you know what i mean like it'd be cool if he made a movie about star
Speaker:Track 2: wars but it then didn't fit into like this whole sort of narrative like this
Speaker:Track 2: had to fit to match exactly with it.
Speaker:Track 3: It wasn't like another skywalker opera.
Speaker:Track 2: Exactly yeah i would love to see that.
Speaker:Track 1: At the time this was the closest we got to that.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah at the time.
Speaker:Track 1: And then what mandalorian And then... I mean, but even Mandalorian.
Speaker:Track 1: Mandalorian, they tied it back. Yeah, they tied it back.
Speaker:Track 1: Star Wars is one of those properties. And we're just special. Yeah.
Speaker:Track 1: Star Wars is just one of those properties that the inertia of the fandom and
Speaker:Track 1: the weight of it, they always come back to the main thing. Because...
Speaker:Track 1: well it's a bono in fact how toxic the star wars fandom is and how like absolutely
Speaker:Track 1: like just horrible they can be and i think.
Speaker:Track 2: You know they.
Speaker:Track 1: End up complaining about everything under the sun and then you know.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah and they're the reason like why those like the two
Speaker:Track 3: like uh the two criminals from fucking episode four get thrown in and such i
Speaker:Track 3: always forget that they're in this movie like bump into them it's like you know
Speaker:Track 3: about to be get into the whole i do know who we are speech and it's like such
Speaker:Track 3: a eye roll moment for me i always forget it's in there.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah they have to do all their little easter eggs and shit otherwise all the
Speaker:Track 2: fans get all mad yeah and they're gonna get mad anyway so you might as well just make them more mad.
Speaker:Track 3: Might as well.
Speaker:Track 2: I was i was looking at that so i i was looking at my history of rate of like
Speaker:Track 2: watching this movie on letterbox The first time I watched it or logged it on
Speaker:Track 2: Letterboxd was after season one of Andor.
Speaker:Track 2: I watched it after that. Then I watched it again after the whole thing.
Speaker:Track 2: I was looking. I gave it three and a half stars in October.
Speaker:Track 2: I watched it on October 7, 2023, which is also kind of funny.
Speaker:Track 2: And every time since then, I've given it five stars.
Speaker:Track 2: I know that like stars or whatever is subjective.
Speaker:Track 1: What changed?
Speaker:Track 2: So the time I watched it may be a time after that.
Speaker:Track 2: Like most of the times I didn't write any review, but I wrote the one time I
Speaker:Track 2: wrote, in light of Andor, I bumped this to five stars despite some of its flaws.
Speaker:Track 2: It's a little bit messy, but it's the best Star Wars arc.
Speaker:Track 2: Seamless transition from Andor makes it perfect. So I feel like it fits so perfectly
Speaker:Track 2: with the Andor series that it goes from like, okay, the movie is good on its own,
Speaker:Track 2: but it just made better by having its, you get the full and or treatment what.
Speaker:Track 1: About it do you think of as messy or did you you know.
Speaker:Track 2: I was trying to think about that
Speaker:Track 2: what i found messy and i think it's and maybe this goes back to the like the
Speaker:Track 2: theories or the things they've been saying how originally the ending was not
Speaker:Track 2: going to kill everyone because they didn't think that disney would allow them
Speaker:Track 2: to kill off all the characters on a movie in Star Wars.
Speaker:Track 2: And so then they redid it, they made it that way.
Speaker:Track 2: And then Tony Gilroy comes in, makes some changes, makes some edits, they did some reshoots.
Speaker:Track 2: It's almost like you can tell there were some scenes that were meant to be happening,
Speaker:Track 2: maybe in between some of them, that would have made more sense.
Speaker:Track 2: Like, part of what I found was messy is that it seems like Jyn goes from,
Speaker:Track 2: I'm not going to help you, fuck the rebellion, fuck Saw Gerrera,
Speaker:Track 2: fuck all the rebellion people, like it always brings me pain to I'm gonna give my life for this.
Speaker:Track 2: It feels like that happens too quickly. And that's like actually one of my other
Speaker:Track 2: two, one other critique of the movie.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah, I'd agree with that. It's a very, it's like a very sudden shift in her character.
Speaker:Track 3: There's not like a lot of explanation as to why she's changed her mind.
Speaker:Track 3: Cause I mean, she's, she goes from the daughter of Galen Erso to basically the like apprentice like,
Speaker:Track 3: of saw guerrera where she's trained and then eventually abandoned but like she
Speaker:Track 3: knows what finding the empire is about and even still she's just like yeah whatever
Speaker:Track 3: not gonna do that anymore and then gets end up ends up caught but it's.
Speaker:Track 1: Her father i don't think i don't i i don't think it comes out of nowhere it's her father when.
Speaker:Track 3: They go to.
Speaker:Track 1: Narkeena 5 no is.
Speaker:Track 2: It no that's what's.
Speaker:Track 1: The what's that what's the planet that he's on not arcana five edu.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah edu.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah it's that it's seeing her father die that's that's it it's seeing her father
Speaker:Track 1: and him talking to her and dying in her arms it's.
Speaker:Track 2: And she realizes that he gave his life yeah to try
Speaker:Track 2: and stop the empire is like why shouldn't die yeah yeah
Speaker:Track 2: I buy that and for people who don't know there's also
Speaker:Track 2: a book there's a bunch of star wars books countless books that are
Speaker:Track 2: like part of canon but there's one that I read recently it's called
Speaker:Track 2: star wars rebel rising and it's the
Speaker:Track 2: period of time between the opening scene of rogue
Speaker:Track 2: one where you see galen urso getting taken by orson krennic back to finish his
Speaker:Track 2: work to the moment when they break jen out of the prison and during that most
Speaker:Track 2: of that time she's working with saw guerrera on like missions training the whole
Speaker:Track 2: time living with him basically his daughter.
Speaker:Track 2: They kind of refer to her as the daughter in the book.
Speaker:Track 2: And it's very clear that she understands what they're fighting against,
Speaker:Track 2: but she seems to be against it because Saw Gerrera in the book,
Speaker:Track 2: like, spoiler for anyone who wants to read this book,
Speaker:Track 2: leaves her behind on one of their missions and she goes to jail.
Speaker:Track 1: Which is directly called out in the movie.
Speaker:Track 2: Yes, they do. Which is interesting because the book came out after the movie
Speaker:Track 2: was released. So they've,
Speaker:Track 2: wrote the book based on that bit well yeah and another crazy thing i mean is that apparently,
Speaker:Track 2: initially she was supposed to be a rebel sergeant instead of a criminal that
Speaker:Track 2: they had rescued and that a bunch of toys they made said sergeant jen urso before
Speaker:Track 2: they changed it in the movie,
Speaker:Track 2: which i think is really weird oh.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah i've heard about that.
Speaker:Track 2: I think that would have sucked i think it makes so much more sense for her to
Speaker:Track 2: be like broken out of prison do you think it's a plot hole for them to have
Speaker:Track 2: figured out where she was and knew who she was how could they have found out.
Speaker:Track 3: They got intel yeah they got spies.
Speaker:Track 2: They have friends everywhere literally.
Speaker:Track 3: Literally they have cassian they have spies yeah true.
Speaker:Track 2: True yeah i mean they can break into like databases or whatever yeah i'm sure
Speaker:Track 2: they're doing in like information dude.
Speaker:Track 3: Clay is chilling on yavin 4 right now.
Speaker:Track 2: That's a good point. That is a good point.
Speaker:Track 1: I'm looking it up.
Speaker:Track 2: Well, do you think also, what do you make of, because it's the,
Speaker:Track 2: you know, Rogue One was released, Tony Giro was part of it.
Speaker:Track 2: He probably had the idea then to create the series, sort of the backstory of it.
Speaker:Track 2: What do you make of the, like...
Speaker:Track 2: Do you think that Andor's character in Rogue One makes sense based on the end of Andor?
Speaker:Track 2: I mean, granted that Tony Giroir wrote it so that it would make sense,
Speaker:Track 2: but do you think it makes sense?
Speaker:Track 1: Hold on. I have an answer to the question about Jynerso.
Speaker:Track 2: Okay.
Speaker:Track 1: It's because Tivik, the mole from Sogare's rebel cell, was feeding Mon Mothma
Speaker:Track 1: and the rebellion information, including Jynersos.
Speaker:Track 1: got it okay because that makes sense as as ward said because they have spots.
Speaker:Track 3: Which is also what saw guerrera.
Speaker:Track 2: Says and he's right now.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah and yeah especially and
Speaker:Track 3: or season two you got saw guerrera like you don't
Speaker:Track 3: know where i am it's like dude i've literally told you where you are dude they've
Speaker:Track 3: tapped your phone imperial cruiser literally parked in orbit where you are but
Speaker:Track 3: yeah sure i don't know where you are it's.
Speaker:Track 1: The brydonian man it's the brydonian it's just you.
Speaker:Track 3: Know you think you tried board gullet recreationally yes god yes he like probably he's.
Speaker:Track 2: Like he like removes you know parts of its you know secretion of something and
Speaker:Track 2: then like probably shoots it in his veins.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 1: It's really, the Saw Gerrera is so much more unhinged in this.
Speaker:Track 3: Oh, yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: Because of all the Rhydonium.
Speaker:Track 1: Oh, yeah.
Speaker:Track 3: That's like the Rhydonium, his paranoia after all this time is just like...
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah, it's just really broken him down as a shell of what he used to be.
Speaker:Track 1: It's, it's kind of sad, especially it's, it is, it's pretty sad,
Speaker:Track 1: especially like when you see at the end and how he very, it's like a switch
Speaker:Track 1: turns and he like very, he turns very noble at the end.
Speaker:Track 1: And it's like, it's, it's like, it's like interacting with somebody with like
Speaker:Track 1: dementia or Alzheimer's when all of a sudden, like when they have a moment of
Speaker:Track 1: lucidity and then all of a sudden it comes back and you're like,
Speaker:Track 1: and they're who are you? They were sad.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah. It is sad.
Speaker:Track 3: I mean, for me, it was kind of like, I felt like, especially how I talked about
Speaker:Track 3: him during the Andor series is like, whenever it's finally his time,
Speaker:Track 3: it's like, he's not going to run. And he's going to just face his fiery demise.
Speaker:Track 3: And it's like, that's what he's been chasing this entire time.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah. Yeah, totally.
Speaker:Track 2: I mean, it also makes sense. So at the sort of the end of near the end of Andor,
Speaker:Track 2: when Andor comes back to Yavin and is telling them the information about the,
Speaker:Track 2: you know, what they learn.
Speaker:Track 2: And they're sort of shit talking Luthan as like this guy's like,
Speaker:Track 2: oh, you know, like, fuck Luthan.
Speaker:Track 2: He doesn't, you know, that's how they feel about Saw too. They just,
Speaker:Track 2: they have this, you know, their little council for the rebels and it's very
Speaker:Track 2: much like their own version of the Senate, you know, honestly,
Speaker:Track 2: like a democratized, not to say there shouldn't be order and all of that thing.
Speaker:Track 2: They completely dismissed the people who essentially made it so they could exist.
Speaker:Track 3: Oh, absolutely. And I mean, it's, I mean, but it's also like how I was saying
Speaker:Track 3: during our Andor coverage was that like Luthan was very much the same as Saw.
Speaker:Track 3: It's just that he was more refined. And like what Luthan would do with a scalpel,
Speaker:Track 3: Saw would do with like a fucking orbital strike if he could.
Speaker:Track 3: Like that's just the main difference between the two.
Speaker:Track 2: Discipline.
Speaker:Track 2: yeah oh yeah so the thing i was saying before is like do you
Speaker:Track 2: think that andor's like arc makes sense like i
Speaker:Track 2: mean basically the end of andor again like we're spoiling all
Speaker:Track 2: this is he's sent on the mission to meet tivik and then basically it opens where
Speaker:Track 2: he's meeting tivik and it seems pretty seamless i mean they had to get andor
Speaker:Track 2: to be at the point where it made sense and i think it's pretty seamless i think
Speaker:Track 2: i said seamless a bunch of times just now we.
Speaker:Track 3: Did say seamless a bunch of times seamless i
Speaker:Track 3: mean yeah very seamless but um
Speaker:Track 3: i mean i think the only thing like not so seamless
Speaker:Track 3: about it is that like he comes back from yadden for with
Speaker:Track 3: clay and then he gets like he's supposed to be grounded and
Speaker:Track 3: like confined to quarters but then
Speaker:Track 3: it's like oh we got we got a spy that will only talk
Speaker:Track 3: to fucking cassian it's like all right man well we were supposed to be confined
Speaker:Track 3: to quarters boy here you go you gotta go do things and then he comes back and
Speaker:Track 3: it's like oh well you gotta go do more things we're gonna forget about you being
Speaker:Track 3: confined to quarters granted rogue one preceded andor but still.
Speaker:Track 2: I think it makes sense because that'd.
Speaker:Track 3: Be the only thing.
Speaker:Track 2: I think it makes sense because the way that
Speaker:Track 2: they treated andor and like what made them
Speaker:Track 2: so mad about his disobeying them is that
Speaker:Track 2: they saw him as like this leader who's done so much good for them and they just
Speaker:Track 2: want him to stop being a fuck up and like do what they want him to do and I
Speaker:Track 2: think they realize like no one else would be able to do any of this and like
Speaker:Track 2: we need him to do this and it's like well fuck it you know we trust him enough
Speaker:Track 2: to do it and what's the what's the,
Speaker:Track 2: character's name in both movies that he's one of the the rebel,
Speaker:Track 2: General Draven like he's the one who like has a trust in him like grounds him
Speaker:Track 2: and then it's sort of like yeah you know we kind of You too, dude.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: I love that actor, too. Alistair Petri, I think. He's very good.
Speaker:Track 1: I mean, I don't, to me, it feels, if they set up at the end of season two,
Speaker:Track 1: they said, you know, Amanda, or they set up that this is what's going to happen.
Speaker:Track 1: So, which, because again, because Gilroy wrote it that way.
Speaker:Track 1: Like, you know, he didn't, you know, wow, I said, you know, a bunch of times, right?
Speaker:Track 1: But Gilroy, he wrote it that way. It was intended that way.
Speaker:Track 1: It makes perfect sense. The only thing that stands out to me watching Rogue
Speaker:Track 1: One is that Andor feels less developed in Rogue One than he does in Andor.
Speaker:Track 1: He feels more one note.
Speaker:Track 1: And I think it's partly because this movie wasn't written to be a Cassian Andor
Speaker:Track 1: vehicle. He is a main part of it. He's a main character.
Speaker:Track 1: But I think it's obvious that it was actually written to be a Jyn Erso story.
Speaker:Track 1: It's a Jyn Erso story, not a Cassian Andor story.
Speaker:Track 1: And it just so happens that.
Speaker:Track 1: I think people really took to Andor's character.
Speaker:Track 1: Um, and I do think they kind of possibly wrote them in themselves into like a, a, uh, a corner.
Speaker:Track 1: Like they were, you couldn't make Andor the show using Jyn Erso.
Speaker:Track 1: It, it would have been like, you couldn't tell that story.
Speaker:Track 1: You couldn't tell Tony Gilroy's story. And the, the, even from,
Speaker:Track 1: any perspective, including what he has talked about in terms of his study of
Speaker:Track 1: revolution, you couldn't tell that with Jairn Arso.
Speaker:Track 1: Because it would be so focused on Saul Guerrero. And Saul Guerrero's approach
Speaker:Track 1: to things, and Saul Guerrero's approach to things is so narrow.
Speaker:Track 1: You couldn't explore any of that further political depth.
Speaker:Track 1: It would have been impossible. And so it's just like, Like, it's just,
Speaker:Track 1: it's like the only, like, thing.
Speaker:Track 1: It's like they don't fit perfectly together in terms of that because Andor seems...
Speaker:Track 1: less fleshed out.
Speaker:Track 2: Look at the poster for rogue one i mean jen
Speaker:Track 2: urso is honestly the sort
Speaker:Track 2: of viewed i feel like is the main person they were making this
Speaker:Track 2: as felicity jones is the first character first actor listed
Speaker:Track 2: on the you know the the uh the thing and so
Speaker:Track 2: i don't i mean the movie is extremely popular sometimes i wonder
Speaker:Track 2: if people like shit on it too because they're like oh strong woman character
Speaker:Track 2: we don't like that you know kind of bullshit but i
Speaker:Track 2: i mean i agree with you i think that telling the jen urso
Speaker:Track 2: story would have been boring i don't they wrote a book about it which i just
Speaker:Track 2: described i don't think it would have been in a compelling story because not
Speaker:Track 2: much honestly happens she trains with saw guerrera for years she's only like
Speaker:Track 2: 23 in the movie like that's her character is pretty young i don't i mean like.
Speaker:Track 1: You think it could have made for an interesting story it just.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah yeah i'm not trying to say like a shit on her as like okay her character
Speaker:Track 2: is stupid it and no one wants to hear it no i know and i'm trying to what i'm
Speaker:Track 2: saying i'm trying to be a misogynist here no.
Speaker:Track 1: No and i don't think you are what i'm saying is that like is i think it would
Speaker:Track 1: it could have been an interesting story it just wouldn't have been the story gilray wanted to tell,
Speaker:Track 1: and i think he looked at what was available and cassian was the obvious choice partly because,
Speaker:Track 1: there was you know a big he's like a he was a blank canvas um.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah that.
Speaker:Track 1: He could work with um.
Speaker:Track 2: And i like they couldn't have made a genosur story with mon mothma like those
Speaker:Track 2: characters don't fit in her exactly yeah.
Speaker:Track 1: Like it would, it could have been a super interesting, it could have been interesting.
Speaker:Track 1: It could have been fun. It could have been awesome, but it would have been fundamentally
Speaker:Track 1: a totally different story without any of the, the,
Speaker:Track 1: the, the gravitas or like the materialist, you know,
Speaker:Track 1: and like the lessons that were are implicit to and, or you would have lost them in the fanaticism.
Speaker:Track 1: of saw guerrera you need luthan.
Speaker:Track 2: Sometimes i think about how like disney
Speaker:Track 2: tolerated saw guerrera's part
Speaker:Track 2: of and or because you had you know mon mothma and luthan as sort of like the
Speaker:Track 2: less you know quote-unquote radical even though i would argue that luthan is
Speaker:Track 2: was still pretty radical i mean the flashback scene where he just like bombs
Speaker:Track 2: a bridge filled with you know
Speaker:Track 2: troopers like that's pretty radical you know
Speaker:Track 2: and who knows whatever shit he did between that moment and
Speaker:Track 2: when the story takes place but like it was
Speaker:Track 2: palatable because they had people
Speaker:Track 2: that were like less quote-unquote terrorists you know like i don't think they
Speaker:Track 2: would allow a movie or a show to be about saw guerrera because that's not palatable
Speaker:Track 2: to to disney i mean wrote and or is barely palatable to disney to be if we're
Speaker:Track 2: being honest but can you imagine a show about saw guerrera And.
Speaker:Track 3: Now we're so lucky we got Andor.
Speaker:Track 2: Never again.
Speaker:Track 3: Would have been luckier if we got the five seasons. Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: People all like, oh, they spent half a billion dollars or whatever on Andor.
Speaker:Track 2: It's like, it was worth every penny. Did you watch it?
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: Kathleen Kennedy. Thank you. Because she left Disney.
Speaker:Track 2: When she stepped down, I kept thinking to myself, did they make her step down
Speaker:Track 2: because they don't want them to make another Andor type show?
Speaker:Track 2: I know I'm sure that's not true. I'm sure she got some outlandish amount of
Speaker:Track 2: money to leave or whatever. You know, who knows?
Speaker:Track 3: It's an under note somewhere in there, though.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah. I mean, I'd be willing to bet that Disney looks back on Andor and probably
Speaker:Track 2: wishes that they didn't make it.
Speaker:Track 2: I mean, I know it made them money, so I guess that softens the blow.
Speaker:Track 2: But sometimes I wonder about that.
Speaker:Track 2: When you go to the Rogue One Wikipedia page, it says it's one of the most expensive films ever made.
Speaker:Track 2: And it's the 25th most expensive film ever made. Granted, like every new Star
Speaker:Track 2: Wars movie is in the top 10 plus, you know, Marvel movies, Avatar movies.
Speaker:Track 2: It doesn't mean anything. It's just, you know.
Speaker:Track 3: It was that Hammerhead Corvette scene, huh?
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah. Like, why?
Speaker:Track 3: The Hammerhead Corvette scene was sick as fuck.
Speaker:Track 2: And the thing that, well, let me ask, this is like completely unrelated,
Speaker:Track 2: like aesthetics of the movie. Like, do you think that the special effects still
Speaker:Track 2: look pretty good for Rogue One?
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah, pretty solid. Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: I think they look better than most Marvel movies.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah, they look better than most new movies. This is before,
Speaker:Track 1: this movie, when was this made?
Speaker:Track 2: 2016.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah. I mean, this is before they really started gutting effects departments.
Speaker:Track 1: Doctor Strange and the Multiverse of Madness is considered kind of like the
Speaker:Track 1: star. Like, that is the movie that came out that, like, everyone was like,
Speaker:Track 1: oh, it was, like, real recognizable. And that was 2022.
Speaker:Track 2: The special effects on that are fucking terrible. Holy shit.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah. And it is the 11th most expensive movie ever made.
Speaker:Track 3: Oh, fuck.
Speaker:Track 1: Okay. So, yeah. um like i said you know like this is this was before you started
Speaker:Track 1: really seeing that like real drop in quality of vfx you know um and yet they're
Speaker:Track 1: still spending a fuck ton of money god.
Speaker:Track 2: This list is crazy yeah i.
Speaker:Track 1: Mean i.
Speaker:Track 3: Wonder if they're thinking it was gonna bomb and they're hoping they could be attacks right off.
Speaker:Track 2: Rogue one yeah i don't know i mean this was the first non uh like a series movie
Speaker:Track 2: for them right then then they made the solo one that was it.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah just.
Speaker:Track 2: Those two yeah.
Speaker:Track 3: So that's well i don't know.
Speaker:Track 2: Maybe i mean maybe possibility made a billion dollars i mean.
Speaker:Track 1: Jeez i don't know i mean they did a fucking banger they hired alan tudyk you
Speaker:Track 1: don't hire alan tudyk if you think you're making them up.
Speaker:Track 2: You're also forgetting that they hired ben mendelson yeah that too and and like
Speaker:Track 2: fucking um the guy was mentioning before uh alistair petri petri too i mean
Speaker:Track 2: a lot of them are like british and australian like stage actors yeah.
Speaker:Track 1: I mean to be fair like when we really if you really look at if you look at the
Speaker:Track 1: cast alone this is definitely not a movie they went into thinking like oh this
Speaker:Track 1: is like a write-off or like this isn't mads mickelson.
Speaker:Track 2: Forrest whitaker forrest.
Speaker:Track 1: Whitaker yeah exactly you know the ben mendelson al tudyk force whittaker and
Speaker:Track 1: madison mickelson right there like you don't put those people in a movie thinking
Speaker:Track 1: you know that you're this is like a you know a hand wave like you know fucking
Speaker:Track 1: whatever who cares about this no i mean.
Speaker:Track 2: The guy uh who plays the the you know
Speaker:Track 2: the one force character donnie yen like he's a pretty well-known like action
Speaker:Track 2: star for movies i mean they probably brought him in here because he could just
Speaker:Track 2: do cool ass shit you know he's in like the john wick series uh or like one of
Speaker:Track 2: them i don't remember what else a bunch of chinese films too like a gently movie if man if.
Speaker:Track 3: Man if man.
Speaker:Track 2: Yes i think he's also in that's what he's most well.
Speaker:Track 3: Known for yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah so he's.
Speaker:Track 3: On like six of them or some shit.
Speaker:Track 2: There's that many of them holy shit.
Speaker:Track 1: Oh yeah it's a lot.
Speaker:Track 2: You're right wow i didn't realize how many of those there were One,
Speaker:Track 2: two, three, four, and then they're making a fifth and a sixth one, apparently.
Speaker:Track 3: I will say with Ben Mendelsohn as Orson Krennic in this movie,
Speaker:Track 3: oh, so much better post and or treatment.
Speaker:Track 3: Like you get to see him walk around as like a fucking force.
Speaker:Track 3: Just like take over every fucking room that he goes into while watching Andor.
Speaker:Track 3: And then you see him in this and he's just another small fish in the Imperial pond.
Speaker:Track 2: I mean, you almost look at him as sort of being like the, what's her name? Deidre.
Speaker:Track 2: Deidre, sorry. Deidre is like, you know, important, but then goes to prison
Speaker:Track 2: for just knowing too much and being trouble on their side. They easily could
Speaker:Track 2: have, Darth Vader could have killed fucking Orson Krennic if he wanted to.
Speaker:Track 2: And like, you're just gone. You're just, you're part of the regime.
Speaker:Track 3: I had to hit him with that banger line first.
Speaker:Track 1: Which one? He meets Vader.
Speaker:Track 3: Be careful not to choke on your aspirations. Yeah. Dude, oh, that's such a good line.
Speaker:Track 1: Oh vader it is a testament to the power of that character that vader does not
Speaker:Track 1: detract from the overall seriousness of this movie um because vader is dangerously,
Speaker:Track 1: close to absurd especially after
Speaker:Track 1: the prequels and what we see there
Speaker:Track 1: um and i really feel
Speaker:Track 1: like this film in a lot of ways almost re rehabilitates his character for what
Speaker:Track 1: little we see of him um and puts him back where he was in turn as a like powerful
Speaker:Track 1: figure with authority and real weight in the Empire.
Speaker:Track 2: You know what's also interesting? They never mentioned Darth Vader one time during Andor.
Speaker:Track 3: I mean, and that's what makes it so good.
Speaker:Track 2: But they mentioned the Emperor, obviously, a number of times.
Speaker:Track 3: Well, yeah, that's like the system of government. We talk about our president, don't we?
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah, that's true.
Speaker:Track 1: I mean, Vader is...
Speaker:Track 2: I like that Vader is in this, actually. I feel like that added a kind of you
Speaker:Track 2: know, that felt like a for the fans kind of shit, but it was cool.
Speaker:Track 1: Vader is like very much like in like the world of like he's like you know he's
Speaker:Track 1: he's like the emperor's right-hand man he's.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah he's.
Speaker:Track 1: Not seen as like a figure of authority in and of it in and of his own right
Speaker:Track 1: he is seen as an extension of the emperor he's an.
Speaker:Track 3: Enforcer basically yeah it was definitely for the fans
Speaker:Track 3: and you can definitely tell it's gareth edwards like first like foray into fucking
Speaker:Track 3: star wars because he does it for the fans because if he would have done it post
Speaker:Track 3: and or Orson Krennic would have been going into like a plain sterile white room
Speaker:Track 3: with like five or six pretty high level ISB and ISA agents.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah. And it would have been fantastic.
Speaker:Track 1: It would have been so great.
Speaker:Track 2: What do you think though about the, I feel like we talked about this way back
Speaker:Track 2: when, when we did the alien Romulus where they did the, you know,
Speaker:Track 2: the deep fake of Tarkin played by Peter Cushing.
Speaker:Track 2: they did his you know computer generated bullshit i feel like they could have
Speaker:Track 2: just not i could have they didn't need to do that like that's also my big mark on this movie.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah yeah they didn't need it he got away with.
Speaker:Track 2: He's cool as hell but like it's fine don't do it.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah it was unnecessary and it also felt like
Speaker:Track 1: i remember when it i remember when it came out
Speaker:Track 1: and how it was talked about like it was it was
Speaker:Track 1: it was a hype moment like it was a a press moment they made such a big deal
Speaker:Track 1: out of it and it was just like nobody actually cares like the audience doesn't
Speaker:Track 1: care about this like you're just stroking your own egos like nobody watching this cares we.
Speaker:Track 2: Don't his family approved of it which i like it's better than that
Speaker:Track 2: than just like you know fucking ai ai him in there for no reason like then they
Speaker:Track 2: also have the carrie fisher leah you know princess leia little bit at the end
Speaker:Track 2: where they you know she had already passed away or no she may have died the
Speaker:Track 2: same year actually let's see
Speaker:Track 2: she died in 2016 as well so you know i'm not a huge fan of that either.
Speaker:Track 2: I feel like you could just have done both of those things without it.
Speaker:Track 2: I mean, you could have done without both of those things.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah, I don't. I honestly, I think the Carrie Fisher one looks a lot worse.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah, the Carrie Fish one looks significantly worse.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah, because they made her look weird.
Speaker:Track 2: It's just like she looks too young. I mean, how old was she probably when that
Speaker:Track 2: first one came out? Let's see.
Speaker:Track 2: She's born in 56, so she's like 23 when that movie first comes out,
Speaker:Track 2: I think. Did I do the math right?
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah, something like that. So, less. Might have been younger.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah, I remember like the...
Speaker:Track 1: Tarkin I was like okay and I remember when she showed I was like oh that I that
Speaker:Track 1: I don't like that at all that doesn't look good and.
Speaker:Track 2: That was all so they could make it literally the final scene be the opening
Speaker:Track 2: scene to you know the original.
Speaker:Track 1: Which they could have done without that they could have yeah they could have
Speaker:Track 1: done it without that and I and I do think that it it is a great sequence like
Speaker:Track 1: I do really like that yeah but they could have done it without that literally.
Speaker:Track 3: Just shot it from the back.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 3: And then cut. Like, cool.
Speaker:Track 2: They could have. They could have done like the silhouette like in the,
Speaker:Track 2: you know, in the, like the shadow or something or reflection and then they had
Speaker:Track 2: the audio of her doing the thing from the first movie and then just have it.
Speaker:Track 1: That's not how Disney works. Yeah. There's totally other ways they could have
Speaker:Track 1: done that that would have been better and not as horrible.
Speaker:Track 3: You're not trying to get that 25th most expensive movie mindset. That's the problem.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: I wonder if they have to pay her estate or her family for that.
Speaker:Track 3: I hope a good amount.
Speaker:Track 2: I think the answer is not enough.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 3: Probably.
Speaker:Track 1: The answer is for all this shit is always not enough.
Speaker:Track 2: I can't find it.
Speaker:Track 1: There is no amount that is appropriate for these fucking things. They do that.
Speaker:Track 1: Now, in terms of the overall politics of Garrett Edwards and what we've seen through his films,
Speaker:Track 1: the fact that this is Star Wars, do we think it detracts from that?
Speaker:Track 1: Because it's almost like too obvious because it's like, oh, it's the Empire.
Speaker:Track 1: Does he say, do the things that he normally kind of like puts out there,
Speaker:Track 1: how impactful does it feel in this?
Speaker:Track 1: comparison to other things.
Speaker:Track 2: Less political than than monster for sure.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah it's star wars the politics are pretty
Speaker:Track 3: easy and laid out for you
Speaker:Track 3: especially his first time doing like an actual
Speaker:Track 3: star wars movie too it's all laid out for you this is what's good this is what's
Speaker:Track 3: bad all right here's a script go for it so it's definitely less political than
Speaker:Track 3: monsters so it's definitely like a softball but like whenever you look at andor
Speaker:Track 3: it's like incredible what he was able to do with that and then the creator oh holy shit.
Speaker:Track 2: I'd holy shit i
Speaker:Track 2: would argue that even though it's like the softball star
Speaker:Track 2: war politic you know empire bad rebel
Speaker:Track 2: good kind of shit he still made a
Speaker:Track 2: movie where everyone dies for
Speaker:Track 2: the cause usually in star wars
Speaker:Track 2: movies when someone dies it's like you know some pilot in some
Speaker:Track 2: random plane like you know red 2 gets
Speaker:Track 2: like shot down like nothing you know that's nothing really happened you
Speaker:Track 2: know like no one important dies really i mean yoda dies but sort of like sort
Speaker:Track 2: of one is you know passes away kenobi dies kind of intentionally during his
Speaker:Track 2: fight with vader having the guts just kill everyone that has to stand has to
Speaker:Track 2: mean a little bit of something i don't know if that's politics i.
Speaker:Track 3: Don't know if it's more so politics but in a star wars film yeah that's pretty gussy.
Speaker:Track 2: And they weren't originally so out.
Speaker:Track 1: Of like out of all the options that you
Speaker:Track 1: could have in terms of like you know telling a
Speaker:Track 1: like story that is like in here like this is
Speaker:Track 1: as far as like without like breaking from
Speaker:Track 1: the star wars like you know main story completely this is as far as you can
Speaker:Track 1: go and like be like overtly like political outside of the very like binary you
Speaker:Track 1: know especially because you know like and i think I think the fact that they
Speaker:Track 1: die is part of that. I think that is political.
Speaker:Track 1: It is the sacrifice. It is the notion of sacrifice and not sacrifice in a hero's
Speaker:Track 1: way. Like, I think that's actually the key.
Speaker:Track 1: Like, the way Cass talks about being in the rebellion and being part of,
Speaker:Track 1: you know, the rebellion.
Speaker:Track 1: It is not about being a hero. It's not about, like, saving the day.
Speaker:Track 1: And even, like, dying, it's not about being the hero.
Speaker:Track 1: It's about getting the job done to further the cause.
Speaker:Track 3: And I agree with that because like you have him talking about like oh like we've
Speaker:Track 3: all done terrible things but like he never says that he regrets it.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 3: He never says that like he would do it differently. He's just like it just needs
Speaker:Track 3: to mean something. So let's get this done.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 3: Let's keep it moving.
Speaker:Track 2: It's like what Bix says like they have to win, right?
Speaker:Track 3: Mm-hmm.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: Whatever you do you do because you think it's gonna mean you win.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: They apparently one of the other, I think the alternate versions of it was that
Speaker:Track 2: one of the fighter, you know, the rebel planes comes down and takes Jyn and Andor away.
Speaker:Track 2: I think that was one of the alternate versions they were considering which I
Speaker:Track 2: think just would have ruined the movie.
Speaker:Track 2: Like, going for the full Hollywood ending in this just does not work.
Speaker:Track 1: I agree 100% especially because I think that the last scene,
Speaker:Track 1: just to double down on how I think that the them dying is inherently like super
Speaker:Track 1: political, but to look at the way they die,
Speaker:Track 1: they sit on that beach and they watch the planet explode and they,
Speaker:Track 1: it could be seen as like basically like
Speaker:Track 1: a sunrise it very it
Speaker:Track 1: looks like a sunrise and like what do
Speaker:Track 1: we like what do we associate sunrises with it's like it's
Speaker:Track 1: the dawn of a new day like this is the future they are watching like the only
Speaker:Track 1: reason that planet is being blown up is because they got the secret they got
Speaker:Track 1: the fucking thing like it is a in the end it is both.
Speaker:Track 1: The the dawn of a future of a
Speaker:Track 1: bright of a future caused but
Speaker:Track 1: you know brought about by their sacrifice by their effort the
Speaker:Track 1: and what are we talking about as you know
Speaker:Track 1: people involved in these things it's like you don't
Speaker:Track 1: fight simply because you hate something you fight because you want to bring
Speaker:Track 1: about a future you have hope for something and like that's what they do they're
Speaker:Track 1: looking at the future before them and then the other on the flip side of it
Speaker:Track 1: it is the it is the flailing of the empire it is the empire's like like what's that what's the,
Speaker:Track 1: empty gesture it's a it's purely just like a a futile like you know gesture
Speaker:Track 1: in the face of defeat they've been defeated it's the beginning of their defeat i.
Speaker:Track 2: Can't help also but since you mentioned the sunrise like you
Speaker:Track 2: go back to luthan's speech in season one
Speaker:Track 2: when when lonnie asks him like
Speaker:Track 2: what he sacrifices and he says i burn my decency for someone else's future i
Speaker:Track 2: burn my life to make a sunrise that i know i'll never see and this is literally
Speaker:Track 2: the last sunrise that andor and that jinn will ever see that's it they'll never
Speaker:Track 2: see the sunrise of the new of the you know the defeat of the empire.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah and i i enjoy like yeah it's a
Speaker:Track 3: jinn urso movie but like it's all
Speaker:Track 3: like cassie and andor is still in it so it's still the
Speaker:Track 3: story of like the two offsprings of rebellion that led to the rebel alliance
Speaker:Track 3: and has made it this far you know cassian being like luthan and cleia's son
Speaker:Track 3: and then jinn being saw his daughter basically and so i like that.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah and honestly it's
Speaker:Track 1: also like it's the notion of like i
Speaker:Track 1: know we've called saw guerrera an anarchist and i
Speaker:Track 1: don't think he is he is in some
Speaker:Track 1: ways but he also isn't he's like he's also very clearly like his organization
Speaker:Track 1: is not horizontal it is not horizontal leadership at all like you know he clearly
Speaker:Track 1: has hierarchy um with radonium at the top,
Speaker:Track 1: um but it is still it it it is,
Speaker:Track 1: Still in, you know, stark opposition to the way the rebellion operates.
Speaker:Track 1: And the fact of the matter is, is that you can't actually have revolution without.
Speaker:Track 1: Like, yes, you need structure and organization and all that shit.
Speaker:Track 1: You need theory and you need off, you know, you need, you know, you also need.
Speaker:Track 1: Stochastic violence sometimes like it's part of it like the two things are part
Speaker:Track 1: of it and that's literally what comes together in the film shows that basically
Speaker:Track 1: you need both things you need the willingness to commit.
Speaker:Track 1: You need the willingness to commit major acts of violence alongside calculated
Speaker:Track 1: thought and planning and organization and structure and all that stuff.
Speaker:Track 1: You need both. You can't just have the one.
Speaker:Track 3: I mean, shit, even the Alliance relies on it. They just do a better job of like
Speaker:Track 3: prettying themselves up about it because Cassian's like, yeah, we're all assassins.
Speaker:Track 3: We're all saboteurs, all murderers.
Speaker:Track 1: Except for the ones who are constantly like i'm not gonna risk about you know
Speaker:Track 1: the the people i'm like they're like you know the council who are like i'm not
Speaker:Track 1: gonna they all back away the fucking.
Speaker:Track 3: Bearded guy who doesn't.
Speaker:Track 1: Do fucking jack shit.
Speaker:Track 2: And the other woman too was like you know refusing to go along with the plants
Speaker:Track 2: like you're not sacrificing shit you're gonna be sitting here in your little
Speaker:Track 2: robe making a little democracy you know votes and shit it's like you're not
Speaker:Track 2: sacrificing i mean all Right. They're former senators.
Speaker:Track 2: Like, I guess they're sacrificing the wealth that they had.
Speaker:Track 2: Mon Mothma was like a trillionaire. Right. I know.
Speaker:Track 1: Of course.
Speaker:Track 2: But, you know, like, they're not the ones that are really sacrificing.
Speaker:Track 2: Poor politicians. Yeah.
Speaker:Track 1: Won't someone think about their origins?
Speaker:Track 2: But I won't get to go back to Chandrila and drink that weird cocktail and dance
Speaker:Track 2: around like I'm on ecstasy anymore. It's sad.
Speaker:Track 2: There's something I just read today that I thought was interesting.
Speaker:Track 3: Hey, I would be pretty sad if I couldn't go back to Shandrilla and have another
Speaker:Track 3: Shandrilla party. Like...
Speaker:Track 2: It's crazy how rich she is like they you sort
Speaker:Track 2: of it's you mean obviously they imply how rich she is but
Speaker:Track 2: it's actually insane yeah how rich
Speaker:Track 2: trillions or whatever oh i know what it was at the
Speaker:Track 2: end of andor they show
Speaker:Track 2: a scene with mon mothma's husband
Speaker:Track 2: and the wife of i'm
Speaker:Track 2: blanking on his name right now like the their you know the family they
Speaker:Track 2: married into mon mothma married into the gangster it
Speaker:Track 2: starts with a D I'm just having a moment where I can't think of his name they
Speaker:Track 2: were trying to figure out like why would they show that like maybe you're sort
Speaker:Track 2: of meant to imply like are they now sleeping together or like why are they kind
Speaker:Track 2: of like both sad in this in like the like their limo you know whatever the limo
Speaker:Track 2: ship yeah yeah and the thing I read was apparently,
Speaker:Track 2: they cut a scene where they go do you remember,
Speaker:Track 2: Ward what the name of that guy was the like the gangster family that Mon Mothma marries into.
Speaker:Track 3: Not off the top.
Speaker:Track 2: Cannot think of his name.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah, it's been a bit.
Speaker:Track 2: But he's like, he apparently owned, was supposed to have owned one of the major news networks.
Speaker:Track 2: And the Empire called him to pull the feed of Mon Mothma's speech.
Speaker:Track 2: And he basically refused to do it.
Speaker:Track 2: Like, this doesn't actually end up getting put into the final episode.
Speaker:Track 2: And supposedly, like them commiserating at the end is sort of like both of our,
Speaker:Track 2: you know, husbands and wives fought against the rebellion and potentially now
Speaker:Track 2: Mon Mothma is like off on the rebellion and who knows what happens to the other
Speaker:Track 2: guy. You know, I can cut that, but.
Speaker:Track 1: He fought, so well, he supported the rebellion because he wouldn't pull it.
Speaker:Track 2: I mean, yeah.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: Say that again?
Speaker:Track 1: He supported the rebellion because he wouldn't cut the Mon Mothma feed.
Speaker:Track 2: Correct. Exactly. Exactly. But you don't ever really, you don't see that on
Speaker:Track 2: screen because they cut that.
Speaker:Track 2: I know. Just like another rich guy who like gives up, you know,
Speaker:Track 2: quote unquote, gives up his wealth potentially.
Speaker:Track 1: I mean, you know. His wealth was not, his wealth was not.
Speaker:Track 3: His, it was a matter of time that his wealth was going to go away.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah. His wealth was not gained, you know, his, his wealth was a counter system.
Speaker:Track 1: in any way. Like, he was essentially a criminal.
Speaker:Track 1: You know, like, that's... Yes, yes. He wasn't going to fare well under a more restrictive empire.
Speaker:Track 2: I would be willing to bet that he made his money. Obviously,
Speaker:Track 2: they say it's, like, through criminal intent or, you know, criminal or illegal ways.
Speaker:Track 2: I suspect that he had some dealings with the separatists before,
Speaker:Track 2: you know, the end of the Clone War and all that.
Speaker:Track 2: I bet he was involved with their side of things, but probably pays off the Empire
Speaker:Track 2: enough to be able to just do what he was doing. There's no backstory,
Speaker:Track 2: so I'm just making this up.
Speaker:Track 1: We'll make it up for him.
Speaker:Track 2: It's fine. We could write a Star Wars book.
Speaker:Track 1: We'll write it.
Speaker:Track 2: Why isn't there a book about Bix?
Speaker:Track 3: Official canon stated here.
Speaker:Track 2: This podcast is canon.
Speaker:Track 1: Yes.
Speaker:Track 2: Someone should write a book about Bix in post.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: Not just her. It'd have to be on other characters too.
Speaker:Track 3: They should re-release this also with a post-credits scene where Dedra finds
Speaker:Track 3: out about the attack on Scarif and that it was Cassian Andor and she just yells, Andor!
Speaker:Track 3: From her prison cell on Arkina. Andor!
Speaker:Track 1: Also a force ghost of Cyril.
Speaker:Track 3: Oh yeah, and a force ghost of Cyril just floating nearby.
Speaker:Track 1: No!
Speaker:Track 2: No
Speaker:Track 2: Don't you know who I am I'm Sarah He.
Speaker:Track 3: Asked who I was.
Speaker:Track 2: Oh, I think one of the best things about Andor is that he just gets the most
Speaker:Track 2: like unceremonial death.
Speaker:Track 3: Oh, it's so good.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah. This pop right in the fucking dome.
Speaker:Track 1: By a character whose name we don't even know.
Speaker:Track 2: We do.
Speaker:Track 1: We know the bellboy's name.
Speaker:Track 2: No, the bellboy doesn't kill him.
Speaker:Track 1: Oh, you're right. I'm sorry. I'm mixed. You're right. I'm sorry.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah. It's the leader of the- Yes.
Speaker:Track 1: Yes. It's the old man.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah. The guy who plays the, have you ever seen the show The Strain?
Speaker:Track 2: I don't know if you've seen that show.
Speaker:Track 1: Oh, yes, I have seen that. It's a terrible show.
Speaker:Track 2: He's in that too.
Speaker:Track 1: That actor. Wait, who is he in that? Is he the-
Speaker:Track 2: He's the vampire.
Speaker:Track 1: Get out. Oh my God, you're bright.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 1: Wow.
Speaker:Track 2: He's great in that show, by the way.
Speaker:Track 1: He is. That show is god-awful, though.
Speaker:Track 2: It started okay, and then it just was like, what's going on here?
Speaker:Track 1: You know what the.
Speaker:Track 2: Worst- Richard Sammel is his name.
Speaker:Track 1: It's the kid. The kid made it work. The longer the kid stuck around, the worse it was.
Speaker:Track 2: Yes. The first season or two I thought was cool, and then I thought,
Speaker:Track 2: like, maybe they could just end the show. But then, like, let's have two more seasons.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 3: I really enjoyed this, the part in season three of Andor when he's arguing with
Speaker:Track 3: Jyn Erso about, like, oh, I've been in this fight since I was six years old.
Speaker:Track 3: It's like, dude, yeah, I saw that in season one. That shit hits hard as fuck, dude. Yeah.
Speaker:Track 1: I just really appreciate there's more K2 in this.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: I like the, uh.
Speaker:Track 3: You know, the- He's so sassy.
Speaker:Track 1: I'm sorry for the slap. I'm sorry for the slap, Cass.
Speaker:Track 2: They cut a few scenes with him. There's apparently one scene when they go to
Speaker:Track 2: Jedha, and he goes up to Jyn Erso, and he's like, you know, Cassian,
Speaker:Track 2: you know, says we should trust you, so I'm not going to kill you.
Speaker:Track 2: Which I wish they had kept in.
Speaker:Track 3: I didn't even shit right before they leave for Scarif, and I was like, I'll be with you.
Speaker:Track 1: Cassian told me to. she told me i had to come.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah it's so
Speaker:Track 2: funny unrelated to k2 but i
Speaker:Track 2: also liked uh i think i mentioned in like our chat is that i
Speaker:Track 2: liked that they in this movie jinn
Speaker:Track 2: is wearing the kyber crystal from her mom around her neck throughout it and
Speaker:Track 2: then luthan gives andor the crystal that he wears around his neck during the
Speaker:Track 2: big you know heist thing and i feel like that's a pretty cool little clearly
Speaker:Track 2: intentional but you know parallel i would think by gilroy but.
Speaker:Track 3: They're both children of the revolution yeah yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: I really should edit this like right now and release it tomorrow because it's
Speaker:Track 2: almost star wars day but i don't think that's gonna happen also it wouldn't
Speaker:Track 2: work out for it to be episode 250 then yeah.
Speaker:Track 1: I mean i i feel like as like a gareth edwards film Um, this does have all of
Speaker:Track 1: his like highlights, all of his like hallmarks, highlights, hallmarks of a Gareth Edwards film.
Speaker:Track 1: Um, it's just.
Speaker:Track 1: hard to see them through the shot like it's
Speaker:Track 1: hard to see them through the glare of star wars that's what
Speaker:Track 1: it is it's not it's it's not that star wars
Speaker:Track 1: is it doesn't cast a shadow over it's just like it shines
Speaker:Track 1: so brightly in our collective psyche and it
Speaker:Track 1: has it's such like it's like oh well yeah
Speaker:Track 1: of course like all these like these you know
Speaker:Track 1: points that he's like are going to
Speaker:Track 1: be here because it's star wars and it's specifically this story
Speaker:Track 1: of star wars about their like very rebellion you
Speaker:Track 1: know like the nitty-gritty of the rebels it's like
Speaker:Track 1: you know it it's like it's it just
Speaker:Track 1: feels obvious you know it's like the gareth edwards
Speaker:Track 1: shined well it has the star wars shine which kind of that's what yeah and it
Speaker:Track 1: outshines the gareth edwards parts you know it's like but when you look at like
Speaker:Track 1: overall it's like oh yeah this it makes sense why you would pick him to do this
Speaker:Track 1: like it makes perfect sense it's.
Speaker:Track 2: Weird i haven't heard of him making like being named to be a director for another
Speaker:Track 2: film since the jurassic world.
Speaker:Track 1: Definitely maybe.
Speaker:Track 3: He's gonna be working on something good.
Speaker:Track 1: On the week on the weekend it.
Speaker:Track 2: Was it's i think it's actually crazy imagine if he just never made another movie
Speaker:Track 2: and his five films are monsters three matt of like the biggest franchise.
Speaker:Track 1: Is in.
Speaker:Track 2: History and the creator that's his five films.
Speaker:Track 1: That would be amazing and.
Speaker:Track 2: I think he'll make other shit he's only weird he doesn't say what year he was born on wikipedia.
Speaker:Track 1: He's ageless i don't know.
Speaker:Track 2: He was frozen in carbonite.
Speaker:Track 1: He graduated college in 96.
Speaker:Track 2: So, 80, 76 he was born?
Speaker:Track 2: Something like that? So, he's almost 50? He's got at least five franchise films
Speaker:Track 2: left. He's got to do an Indiana Jones movie.
Speaker:Track 1: No, no. Nobody needs to do another Indiana Jones movie, okay?
Speaker:Track 1: Nobody needs to do that. We could just stop them.
Speaker:Track 1: We've had enough. They could stop. No more.
Speaker:Track 2: Fast and the Furious?
Speaker:Track 1: I'll give him Fast and the Furious. I'd love to see this man I'd love to see
Speaker:Track 1: Gareth Edwards make a Fast and Furious film yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: I don't know it's funny i'm surprised he hasn't done a remake yet i feel like
Speaker:Track 2: that would be his next uh thing to take some because that's all hollywood does
Speaker:Track 2: anyway is make remake so you know he makes a remake of i don't know i have no
Speaker:Track 2: idea what he would make and.
Speaker:Track 3: Gareth edwards remake of friday the 13th.
Speaker:Track 2: Remakes kindergarten cop oh.
Speaker:Track 1: He does you know he honestly i mean he pretty much exclusively does sci-fi.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 1: He's going to make the next remake of Total Recall.
Speaker:Track 2: I was about to say that, but they've made one too recently. I feel like it's
Speaker:Track 2: not quite time to make another remake.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah, but we could just ignore that one because it's terrible.
Speaker:Track 2: I didn't see it, so.
Speaker:Track 1: We could just ignore it.
Speaker:Track 3: Pretty bad.
Speaker:Track 1: Never happened.
Speaker:Track 2: Ooh, you know what he could remake? Event Horizon.
Speaker:Track 1: Ooh.
Speaker:Track 2: I feel like a monster, like a shit monster movie would be kind of up his alley.
Speaker:Track 1: Yes.
Speaker:Track 3: Put him on the, put him on an alien movie.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: There's a franchise.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah, there you go. That's a franchise.
Speaker:Track 3: He can do something with that. Yeah. He can work with that.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: He said in the Wikipedia, it says that Star Wars was the reason he wanted to become a filmmaker.
Speaker:Track 2: So the fact that he made the Rogue One movie is actually almost pretty perfect. It's crazy though.
Speaker:Track 2: I feel like he didn't do a whole lot and then somehow was making Godzilla and Rogue One.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: Who did he know?
Speaker:Track 3: Honestly, crazy leap from monsters to that.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah. They're like, hey, we're going to have you direct Godzilla.
Speaker:Track 2: Monster's not bad. The biggest franchise in history. After you made one movie.
Speaker:Track 3: On like barely a budget that you shot partially illegally.
Speaker:Track 2: That you did special effects on a computer like in your bedroom.
Speaker:Track 1: You know? Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: I don't know. Gareth Edwards, you're still welcome to come on Left of the Rejector.
Speaker:Track 2: Email us at leftwithrejector at gmail.com.
Speaker:Track 3: Only because I couldn't find your ass.
Speaker:Track 1: Come on, man. Come fucking talk to us.
Speaker:Track 2: And if you aren't listening, but, like, your assistant is listening, you know...
Speaker:Track 2: joe or jane put us up i don't know i mean i got a wallace sean's agent to uh
Speaker:Track 2: respond to me maybe gareth edwards agent will respond yeah.
Speaker:Track 3: Do it a shot fuck it.
Speaker:Track 2: I'll email we're.
Speaker:Track 3: The preliminary,
Speaker:Track 3: experts and or.
Speaker:Track 2: Oh man i have i found out who it is his talent agent or like his agents are
Speaker:Track 2: but it doesn't the website i found like graze out their email address unless you pay how.
Speaker:Track 1: Much how much is it.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah how much is it patreon subscribers listeners if you'd like to crowdsource
Speaker:Track 2: us at bookingagentinfo.com to reach out how much.
Speaker:Track 1: Could it possibly be.
Speaker:Track 2: I don't know let's see let's see how much it costs I'm.
Speaker:Track 3: Gonna guess 50 bucks.
Speaker:Track 2: 50 bucks I'm trying to figure out what the actual price is because if you go
Speaker:Track 2: to the sign up page it doesn't tell you bullshit.
Speaker:Track 1: I hate that shit.
Speaker:Track 2: You have to then sign up and then it'll be like, oh, actually,
Speaker:Track 2: you know, it doesn't say you have to pay. It just says you have to sign up.
Speaker:Track 2: That can't be.
Speaker:Track 3: All right, Patreon subscribers, make this account for us.
Speaker:Track 2: I have a burger email. I'll throw my burger in there. My name is Cassian Andor at jr.com.
Speaker:Track 3: That's sure to get some attention.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 3: That's his word.
Speaker:Track 1: That'll do it. Do it.
Speaker:Track 2: If I send him an email from Cassian and or doing that, he's like,
Speaker:Track 2: yo, dude, you fucking died though, man.
Speaker:Track 1: You fucking died.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah. One, you weren't real. Two, you're dead. What the fuck?
Speaker:Track 2: Dude, Scarif is gone. There is no Scarif.
Speaker:Track 3: No one made it off Scarif, bro. Oh.
Speaker:Track 2: There's apparently also another deleted scene where uh what was it i just saw
Speaker:Track 2: it like so someone took apparently if you watched the trailer there's a whole
Speaker:Track 2: bunch of clips that just aren't in the movie which kind of sucks damn no deleted season been released i.
Speaker:Track 1: Don't remember the trailer at all.
Speaker:Track 2: I don't either i don't even remember seeing the trail i just remember seeing
Speaker:Track 2: the movie being like okay i'm gonna go see this oh.
Speaker:Track 3: We got a lot of robbed of a lot of stuff in andor season one and two so i'm
Speaker:Track 3: not surprised if it happened in season three two.
Speaker:Track 2: Here we go i got his agents i got his manager, I got his agent, and his other agent.
Speaker:Track 3: Like, I haven't forgotten that we were supposed to get a standalone bottle episode
Speaker:Track 3: that was supposed to be horror-themed of K2SO and his ship.
Speaker:Track 3: Like, that would have been so sick.
Speaker:Track 2: Yeah, we got fucked on that.
Speaker:Track 3: We got so fucked.
Speaker:Track 2: Can they make, like, a K... They can't really make a K2 prequel something,
Speaker:Track 2: because he's not really...
Speaker:Track 2: He's not in a peer... Well, yeah, right. I mean, like, he's in every part of
Speaker:Track 2: the show and movie, you know, and or in this, so he doesn't have his own adventures.
Speaker:Track 1: Okay, I have bad news. Kenneth Edwards is, currently, he is in talks to return
Speaker:Track 1: for Jurassic World Rebirth 2.
Speaker:Track 2: Fuck.
Speaker:Track 1: Which, like, we don't need. We don't need this.
Speaker:Track 3: We don't need that. No one needs that.
Speaker:Track 2: Especially the fact.
Speaker:Track 1: Am I going to watch it?
Speaker:Track 2: They cost like $300 million.
Speaker:Track 1: Yes.
Speaker:Track 1: Am I going to watch it? Yes. Do we need it?
Speaker:Track 2: You know what? I might not watch it. I'm certainly not going to pay for watching it.
Speaker:Track 3: Oh, I'm not going to pay to watch it either, but I'm going to watch it.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 3: There's dinosaurs in that motherfucker.
Speaker:Track 1: I will probably pay to watch it.
Speaker:Track 2: I was going to say, I will probably pay. Seeing in the theater is cool.
Speaker:Track 3: But I just- There's fucking dinosaurs in there.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah, there's dinosaurs in there.
Speaker:Track 3: I'm going to look at that.
Speaker:Track 2: Can they have like, can they squeeze K2 into the Jurassic Park movie somehow?
Speaker:Track 2: He's like fossilized somehow and they, you know.
Speaker:Track 1: I watch most things with dinosaurs.
Speaker:Track 2: Damn. Well, episode 250 in the books.
Speaker:Track 3: Look at us.
Speaker:Track 1: Yeah. I mean, honestly, this felt, it felt almost anti-climbing.
Speaker:Track 1: Like we don't have, like, I feel like we should have, you know,
Speaker:Track 1: I feel like it would have been even better to have an episode for like 250.
Speaker:Track 1: We just like had something really fucking like, like really dramatic to like
Speaker:Track 1: talk about and like shit on. Well.
Speaker:Track 3: Yeah.
Speaker:Track 2: See, the thing is, we could just not release this as episode 250.
Speaker:Track 1: That's true. That is true.
Speaker:Track 2: I could just dub over the part where I say 250 and say 249.
Speaker:Track 2: For me, Evan, Bill and Ward, we will catch you next time. We have friends everywhere.
Speaker:Track 1: We do have friends everywhere.
Speaker:Track 3: Have a good one.
